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Ezekiel’s Valley of Dry Bones and the “Shaking”

A “Prophesyingly” Interpretive Commentary (Ezek 37:1-14 (NASB))

The Vision
Ezek 37:1 - The hand of the LORD was upon me, and He brought me out by the Spirit of the
LORD and set me down in the middle of the valley; and it was full of bones.

-hand of the Lord upon & brought out by the Spirit - Ezekiel was made to see this
representation through a vision only and not in reality. As such it was God showing him what
was the case/condition with Israel. As Israel, in mainly the surviving tribe of Judah then, which
had actually been judged (Ezek 9) some ca. 7 years before[1]1 (See also in the outline chart of
Ezekiel here). This vision is therefore a representation of what is, however, to the extent that it is
shown (i.e, many, dry, bones strewn across a valley), which was not a depiction of actual reality
with the people of Judah or Israel, it is really a representation of how God was seeing things.

-the valley - It is also significant that God has brought Ezekiel to “the valley”. First of all, with
the use of a definite article in referring to the “valley” in this vision, it implies that Ezekiel knew
exactly in which “valley” he had been brought, it was evidently the same ‘known valley’ that
God had instructed him to go to, so that He could “speak” to him there, back in Ezek 3:22, 23
(cf. Ezek 8:4). Indeed the valley was a common place for such official decisive meetings,
particularly ones that could potentially evolve into open armed conflict resolutions (cf. Neh 6:2,
(Neh 6:3)). And as the valley was a terrain without any natural obstacles (cf. Isa 40:4); nor
hampering marsh-type patches of water (cf. Isa 41:18), it was indeed the perfect place to have
two (large) warring armies, and all of their warring “(mobile) implements” [of that time] (e.g.,
horses and horse-drawn chariots), meet (2 Chr 35:22; cf. Zech 12:11[2]2). However in that first
valley meeting with Ezekiel, God, being on the side of Ezekiel, had there re-created the
foundational vision of Ezekiel’s ministry of him seeing, thus grasping/understanding, the ‘Glory
(= Character) of God.’ (Ezek 3:23 = Ezek 1:1ff). And indeed in that valley meeting, God there
first gave Ezekiel “warring” instructions as to the actions that must now be taken against
rebellious Israel (Ezek 3:24-27ff).

Ezek 37:2 - He caused me to pass among them round about, and behold, there were very many
on the surface of the valley; and lo, they were very dry.

-on the surface of the valley - The way these bones are shown to be strewn about on the surface
of a valley (or “plain”), this is the depiction of an army that had been assembled there for battle.
In fact, there may be a prophetic/thematic significance with the fact that an ultimate battle is
mentioned in the next two chapters, i.e., the one against ‘Gog from Magog’ (Ezek 38 & 39; cf.
Rev 20:8). So God’s People then may have gathered there to counter that looming threat.
However, as depicted in the present vision, God first had a “Spiritual Reviving” (leading to the
Latter Rain) and “Battalions Reforming” (cf. GC 425.1-2; PK 725.1/2; EW 52.1) work to do
amongst them (=LDE 189.3). However, and towards this Final Conflict end, as spoken in the
vision that immediately follows this one, in Ezek 37:15-28, God first needed to do a full

Restoration of His Israel (=Rev 7).

-same, prior vision, valley - Interestingly enough, as already introduced above at the Ezek 37:1
commentary, God had brought Ezekiel to this manifestly same valley back in Ezek 3:22, 23,
where this present war would take place. Therefore God had brought him there, and that to give
him warring instructions against Israel, (that indeed if not heeded would result in this present
state of utter defeat), long before any hint of a major war had become evident. (Amos 3:7).
Also/Thus, by sequitur implication, seeing/understanding the Glory of God (Ezek 1:1ff), as
Ezekiel did in that valley, pivotally had much to do with that coming major war. (COL 69:1-2;
414.1-416.1; -discussed here&depicted here; cf. Rev 14:7).

-[bones] were very dry - The fact that there bones are very dry indicates that they had lying
there dead for many years by then.

Ezekiel 37:3 - He said to me, "Son of man, can these bones live?" And I answered, "O Lord
GOD, You know."

-"O Lord GOD You Know" - The answer of Ezekiel here is echoed in Revelation 7:13, 14
where one of the 24 elders actually “answered” manifestly a question that John had on his mind
while gazing at the Great Multitude that resulted from the sealing of Israel (vss. Rev 7:4-12).
John was evidently surprised by this turnout and the Elder pointed out exactly how these had
come to “triumphed” (vss. Rev 7:14b ff).

-=John's Throne Room Experience - Interestingly enough, the last time that John had
encountered one of those elders in his revelation was in the Throne Room scene back in Rev 4 &

Ezekiel 37:4 - Again He said to me, "Prophesy over these bones and say to them, 'O dry bones,
hear the word of the LORD.'

-...and say to them - The fact that Ezekiel is here instructed to speak to these dry bones, and that
they could “hear”, shows that this was indeed a representation of the spiritual state of God’s

Ezekiel 37:5 - "Thus says the Lord GOD to these bones, 'Behold, I will cause breath to enter you
that you may come to life.

-cause breath to enter - “Breath” is indeed understood as a “spirit”; here the Spirit of God. This
does come to bring life.

Ezekiel 37:6 - 'I will put sinews on you, make flesh grow back on you, cover you with skin and
put breath in you that you may come alive; and you will know that I am the LORD.'"

-will put...make...cover....put....may come... - It is striking to see that God will actually,

forcefully do this and it is actually only after that it is done, that God’s People will
recognize/acknowledge that ‘He is the LORD.’

Ezekiel 37:7 - So I prophesied as I was commanded; and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and
behold, a rattling; and the bones came together, bone to its bone.

-I was made to prophesy as I was commanded - This indeed is the accurate rendering of the
passive Niphal verbal form used here in the underlying Hebrew text. So Ezekiel here is just
following orders. And, no doubt to his surprise, as he was prophesying, the bones gradually
started to come to together.

-there was a noise - The term “noise” = “sound/voice” (=Rev 11:12's “voice”; i.e., as with other
mentions below, same applicable message as it has been for prior Two Witnesses) This is when
the Rev 4:1's eschatologically resetted message, and its Grand (Prolonging) Plan, that Rev 11:12
cryptically alludes to, is confirmed by God (=Rev 3:9 = LS 33.3), as indeed, that Philadelphian
Door (Rev 3:8) long ‘(re)-set before the (lone), promisedly-princely (Rev 3:21) Shaking-victor
out of Laodicea, and opened by its Davidic Key (Rev 3:7), is now shown to have been the
‘righteousness-terrible (Rev 19:11ff) warringly indicting&condemning prosecution directly from
the Heavenly Intelligence.’ (CET 228.2).

-and behold, a rattling - The term “rattling” is actually more forceful as it speaks of a
“Shaking” (Amos 1:1; Zech 14:5 - LXX/Greek “seismos”) So even when it is speaking of a
“tumult” or “commotion” it is actually speaking of ‘an earth shaking one’....It just is not actually
the “harvest sifting” Shaking (=Rev 11:13b), but a quasi-make shift one which preludes and
prepares it (=Rev 11:13a).

::Application: This (seismic) “Shaking” is thematically linked to the one spoken of here from
Rev 11:13a. (= ‘the (distinct) shaking of the powers of the (powers that rule on the) Earth’ (=EW
41.1-2. See the Historical "shaking" of world ruling powers: here. For the future, Eschatological,
worldwide realization cf. this pointed post -depicted in Episodes #1-#22 here); [-Episodes #23-
#59 there depict the (distinct), (‘religiously-related’), ‘powers that rule in the heavens (=“in
religious realms”)’ which are “then”/next shaken (=Heb 12:26), symbolized by the Sun
(=righteousness/(socio-)economy), Moon (=religious economy), and Stars
(=religious/righteousness leaders)] =Isa 24:16-23|Heb 12:25-29) See much more on the results
of this development in this post.

Ezekiel 37:8 - And I looked, and behold, sinews were on them, and flesh grew and skin covered
them; but there was no breath in them.

3 breath in them - As in the sequence of things planned/prophesied back in Ezek
37:6, though these bones had been reassembled and being refitted with sinews, flesh and skin,
they were still lifeless as they still were missing the breath/spirit of God. They were thus really
not alive yet. As seen in the next verse, these now “enfleshed” bodies as still “slain” (i.e., dead).
The revival process had begun but was not complete until they came to have this Spirit of God.

-=NT's: "birth from above" - (This spiritual theme is very allusive to the New Birth process
mentioned by Christ in John 3:1-9ff, where it is the breath of God that is really the key to the
New Birth and not mere physicality.)

Ezekiel 37:9 - Then He said to me, "Prophesy to the breath, prophesy, son of man, and say to the
breath, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these
slain, that they come to life."'" (=Rev 11:11, 12)

-prophesy..., prophesy - Ezekiel is now here insistently ordered to prophesy to the breath itself.
He was to say to this breath to come from the Four Winds.

-=Rev 7's "Four Winds" - With this vision being thematically closely tied to the effect of the
Sealing in the Great Multitude of Rev 7, the mention of the Four Winds here is allusive to the
Four Winds mentioned in Rev 7:1-3 which had been held back, at the command of a Mighty
Angel (see 20MR 216.6-217.1),[3]3 so that the Sealing of the 144,000 could take place, starting
with Judah. This vision is a smaller scale of the Rev 7 Great Multitude, focusing on the tribe of
Judah only, which as it will be shown, is the “House of Israel.” (See more on this ‘Four Winds’
event/development in this post.)

Ezekiel 37:10 - So I made myself to prophesy as He commanded me, and the breath came into
them, and they came to life and stood on their feet, an exceedingly great army. (=Rev 11:11, 12)

-made myself to prophesy - Here the verb “prophesied” is in the reflexive intensive for, (the
Hithpeel form) and literally shows that Ezekiel, no doubt at the related urgency of God in Ezek
37:9, ‘made himself to prophesy’. The breath indeed did come into them and they indeed came
to life and, interestingly enough, became an army. This shows/confirms that, as depicted in Ezek
37:2, this had indeed been an army gathered in plain for a battle. The fact that they are
assembled as an army after their revival shows that this battle had yet to occur. Yet somehow,
they had been strewn there as if already soundly defeated by an opposing army. That has only
been seen in Israel’s history when an army suddenly turned on themselves and completely killed
themselves off (2 Chr 20:22-24), or by direct action of God (Isa 37:36/2Kgs 19:35; (2 Chr 13:12-
19); 2 Chr 32:20-22; cf. Isa 31:4b-5, 8). So by implication this can come to be if this army was
similarly guilty of having defeated themselves by such “in-fighting” or if God had acted against
them. The prior choice contextually seems to be the case here and can figuratively be fulfilled
today through especially trying to do the work of the Church Militant through competitive
means, as economically seen in Capitalism and its pervasive systemic reach, when adopted and

allowed to do so. (= Zech 13:5b, 6 -see here)

::Application: This notion of a ‘resulting, exceedingly great army’ is, as discussed in here (see
at Rev 19:14), the, indeed Two Witnesses-initiated one finally “winds-materialized” and
organized during the prophetic Sixth Era’s Trumpet (Rev 9:12- =Rev 7:4-8ff), and is
synonymous with the post-whirlwind judgement of God shown to EGW. See this post.

God Explains the Vision

Ezekiel 37:11 - Then He said to me, "Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel;
behold, they say, 'Our bones are dried up and our hope has perished. We are completely cut off.'

-the "House of Israel" - There is a difference between saying simply “Israel” and “the house of
Israel”. The expression “house” of refers to an inner core of that great entity. It is like a nucleus
from which the greater entity can be reformed. It also represents the portion of that greater entity
that is vital to its survival. As seen in Ezek 9:9 & 37:16, the “House of Israel” and “Judah” are
not one and the same thing however the House of Israel was contained within the surviving tribe
of Judah and is conflatedly addressed as such throughout the book of Ezekiel (ca. 83X - e.g.,
Ezek 3:1, 4, 5, 7; 8:6, etc). Judah had the added burden and responsibility of bringing about the
reestablishment of the other 10+ tribes of Israel. So they indeed also contained that “house” in
their midst and this was indeed their paramount reason of existence and why God had worked to
preserve them as a Remnant of His former whole nation. That is also why Judah is shown to be
the first tribe sealed in the (related) 144,000 Sealing prophecy of (Rev 7:4).

-behold they say:... - With this explanation actually reverting back to the time when the bones
were lifeless, God is stating how these symbolic bones of the House of Israel (within Judah) had
felt. They felt that they were beyond any chance of being revived and that apparently because
they were “hopeless”. They felt that they had been “separated”. This supposed “separation” is
actually not the covenant related “cutting off” reserved for those who God had rejected and
condemned to death. It was just as mere separation. So the sense of these dry bones, also
supposing a perishing of their hope/expectation/longing, was actually an overstatement of actual
events. They were not as “beyond usefulness” as they thought.

Ezekiel 37:12 - "Therefore prophesy and say to them, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I will
open your graves and cause you to come up out of your graves, My people; and I will bring you
into the land of Israel.

-fallen in individual graves, not on (battle) field - Now the scene shifts to normative graves vs.
an open-field strewning. This is thus a further detailing of what the real state of these slain ones
had been. They had not even gathered in the valley/plain as an army for a battle and been slain
by an opposing force, but had simply, individually, naturally died and been normatively buried.

-...bring you into the land of Israel(!) - The endgoal theme of the prior vision is also refocused

here to show that it is the restoration to the land of Israel (from both Babylon and other places in
the world, which also was in the realm of the then ruling Babylonian Empire).

Ezekiel 37:13 - "Then you will know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves and
caused you to come up out of your graves, My people.

-Then you will know... - Again, it is actually after that this revival/resuscitation is completed
that these people would fully understand and acknowledge their God.

Ezekiel 37:14 - "I will put My Spirit within you and you will come to life, and I will place you
on your own land. Then you will know that I, the LORD, have spoken and done it," declares the

-sequence of 'reviving' - As stipulated in this verse, the sequence of things will be that God will
first put His Spirit in them, reviving them (their already reformed and enfleshed body) back to
life and then place them back into their own land. Then will these people understand what has
taken place here.

-reorganization, then reviving.... - And the sequencing is key here, prior to being filled with
God’s Spirit, they have to be bodily “re-organized”, culminating in the putting of flesh on their
rejoined bones and inner organ or else they are (indeed) no better than what the (Eschatological)
Babylonian Mark of the Beast Camp will become after God has ‘“strongly” (Rev 18:8ff),
warringly, judged it’ (Rev 19:17-21 -see here). Once that ‘bodily re-organization’ (LDE 189.3b)
has been completed then God can fill that “body” with the full measure of His (Latter Rain)
Spirit. (=LDE 189.1-196.1)

Current Day’s Application[4]4

For now 17+ years, since the release of this initial, eschatological, message on Revelation
11 back in June 2000, the “Testimony to the Church” has been, and continues to be, based on
the Bible, SOP and actual, fulfilling developments, that: ‘because of the unacceptable state and
works of the Church, time will again, as with the first generation of SDA, and Ancient Israel,
both, respectively, spiritually and literally, on the borders of the Promise Land, be prolonged.
However God’s still planned Great Work would continue to advance.’ So, as detailed here, an
eschatological age of prophetic fulfillment would come to pass. Most SDA have rejected this
message, mainly because they saw nothing wrong with the way they were as a God’s professed
People, nor in how they were conducted God’s work, which was, and still is, mainly through
spurious capitalistic methods. As such God’s work has been artificially limited by the
‘commands of men’; and fallen/evil men at that. SDA’s have also rejected this Biblical Message
because accepting it would mean that the long proclaimed and adhered to
“Hope/Expectation/Longing” of the Second Coming, pointedly in their lifetime, would,
according to their understanding, surely not occur in their lifetime. So they saw it best to reject

that call for practical Sabbatical Works, and continue to “profess” that ‘they believe in the soon
Return of Christ.’ What they Theologically do not understand is that mere profession of the
Second Coming won’t make it happen. By their works, or actually lack thereof, in the Light of
what they should be for this most blessed and, variously, rich Church, they are the ones who are
postponing the Glorious Return of Christ, and refusing to fulfill Christ’s Gospel Mandate only is
compoundedly making this much worse, and that also to their own peril. So, as Jesus said, by so
‘wishing to save their lives’ they are actually losing it, but those who lose it for the Gospel’s
sake will save it. (Mark 8:35). However the “moronically” expedient thing for them to do was to
ignore the Gospel mandate claims of Christ’s Gospel.

So here these SDA Believers are depicted in this vision to Ezekiel (misunderstandingly)
claiming/believing that their “Hope” was lost in the light of their evident slain, dried up bones
conditions as depicted by God in vision to Ezekiel. They also felt doomed, decreed to death,
even “cut off”. However that does not have to necessarily be the case. God’s prolonged work
which had started when the Jesus-Commissioned Mighty Angel had command Four other
Mighty Angels to hold the Four Winds (see in this post), was not necessarily an utter end for
them. Though the Second Coming could, and probably would be prolonged, due to their own
faults and thus actually for their salvific benefit, they still could have a great part to do in this
Greater Work of God. Also, like the SDA Church’s belief that they currently are marshaling
towards the prophesied Final Conflict, indeed the Battle of Har-Mageddon, and actually see
themselves as already in that battlefield, ready and even present long before their enemies know
to come to that prophetic battle field and fight them. (As seen in many popular claims of
‘fulfilling Sunday Law events’ or other conspiracies supposedly aimed at SDA’s, which those
who are accused of doing such acts actually are not even doing so, especially not knowingly. -
Actual acts against, pointedly, SDA’s, which will fulfill Final Events will all be knowing and
deliberate ones.) So as God goes on to show in Ezek 37:13, 14, these deluded dry bones had
actually just been lying dead in their own graves and not from even, honorably despite defeat, in
a (spiritual) battlefield conflict. So, all this time, they had not been ‘fighting the good fight of
faith’. (1 Tim 6:12).
From Ezekiel`s first wave of prophesying, these dry bones are physically restored, yet
they are still lifeless, lacking God`s Spirit. That ‘life giving breath’ is to come from the Four
Winds which all shows that it is only when the Church realizes|understands|acknowledges what
has taken place in these times with the holding back of the Four Winds (= a halting of Final
Events) due to their own individual (graves) and collective (valley) unworthiness and unfitness
for God’s Final Conflict, all given birth to the Eschatological wave of Bible Prophecy, will it
then ‘come to life’, even a New Birth Life, doing the actual works of Christ, fulfilling His
Gospel Commission. In doing this work, this Church Triumphant Work, as it inevitably due, the
Church will then have restored God’s Israel. It is probably only after this comes to pass that it
will truly understand all that has taken place here and that this is indeed God’s Will and His
Doing. (RH, January 17, 1893 par. 7-10)...
...And as detailed in the “eyes like a flaming fire” section in here, this Ezekiel 37
“resurrection through God’s “Son of Man” (e.g., Ezek 37:9, 11) prophesying” was symbolically
shown in vision to EGW, in her first “vision”, in EW 15.2-16.1's (a) “silver trumpet”
(=typological/second-best) resurrection through the “Son of Man” (=Rev 14:14-16's Church,

indeed “Shaking”, “Harvesting” (Matt 13:36-43|COL 62-69|70-75), by (b) in actually,
‘paramountly/solely regards and acts (=“eyes and hands” (=Dan 12:6-7|Rev 10:5-7)) towards/for
heaven’ (=Exod 32:11-14), (c) then having “wrapped himself” in those: “unworthy (=Rev 6:16-
17|DA 825.4)-professed-people-“through and through”-searching, “flame of fire” “Theological

{"Come Alive (Dry Bones)" featuring Lauren Daigle - Live from the CentricWorship


Ezek 37:2
Valley vs. Mountain
GC 425.1-2
PK 725.1
EW 52.1
LDE 189.3

COL 69.1-2

Ezek 37:7
IBHS p.378


Ezek 37:8

Ezek 37:9


Ezek 37:10
The Great Army

Ezek 37:14 - Flesh, Body, Spirit

Current Day's Application
RH, January 17, 1893 par. 7-10

EW 15.2-16.1 and Ezek 37

"Come Alive (Dry Bones)" featuring Lauren Daigle - Live from the CentricWorship Retreat
<div align="center" class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;">
<iframe allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="360"
src="" width="640"></iframe><br />

Note #2 - Zech 12:11

Note #3 - Elijah’s Commission
PK 119.1
PK 121.2

Note #4 - SDA Series/Attempts
Why Revival Waits
Revival of True Discipleship
Preparing for Rain

July 20, 2013
Good informative and Church of God needs to heed into

July 20, 2013
Thanks John...The SDA Church has instead insisted on pursuing its, at best, <a
purious revival efforts</a>. They like learning <a
hard way’</a> (=Amos 7:7-9) instead of, straightly/fully, God’s Way.

God Bless!

July 20, 2013

Revive us oh Lord to rise up an army

July 20, 2013

You can see the pivotal understanding which will produce this “army with many banners” (PK
725.1) in <a href=>this

Gilda Harrington Emailing

<i>[From an Emailed Comment]</i>:

<b>August 15, 2013 02:54 PM</b>

Thank you. While reading your commentary, I thought you might be a SDA, it is so well
done. I'm glad to see I was right. I love our church, it is such a pleasure to be Bible based
and not subject to the traditions of men. Well done! GH

<b>August 15, 2013 08:54 PM</b>

Hello GH, Thank You for the comment. I am glad you appreciated the Ezek 37 commentary.

To be full-disclosurely accurate, as I state and reference in my <a

href=>blog’s “Profile” section</a>, I
am indeed of SDA Background <a
href=>(born and raised in the SDA
Church)</a>, but since then, <a
href=>(ca. 1999 to be
precise)</a>, because the SDA Church has, as cited <a
href=>here</a> and
<a href=>here</a>,
persistingly refused to practice what they preach, I have gradually no longer considered myself
to (at least technically) but now instead consider myself to be <a

SDA”</a>. As revealed in the Bible and <a
href=>SOP</a>, there is some
much more that God wants to reveal and have His People and Remnant Cause do towards
fulfilling the Full Gospel/Sabbatical will of Christ and God (=Matt 25:31-46; <a
href=>DA 637.1</a>) [See <a
href=>here</a> and in <b><a
dedicated blog post</a></b> than what SDA are, most dangerously (DA 825.4 = Rev 14:9-11),
artificially and spuriously limiting Him and themselves to. This entire <a
href=>“Theological Views”
blog</a> is dedicated to searching out the Bible and SOP to bring out that <a
r Light.</a>

<b>August 15, 2013 09:28 PM</b>

<b>Hi [NJK], understand your position. I notice a lot of apostacy in the church, but isn't it
prophetic? To me the church is a perfect representation of Laodecia. I am a big admirer of
Dr Veith, and he is always admonishing us to 'buy glue'. It is difficult sometimes, but I love
Sister White, and she did mention despite the problems to stick with the system. I do have
several friends who are struggling with this same issue. I hope the 'shaking' comes, the
latter rain, and the conclusion of sin, and we can go home. God Bless you! G</b>

<b>August 16, 2013 12:12 AM </b>

Hi G, (Just noticed your response email). <a

Veith</a>’s presentation are always insightful and interesting. Glad to hear that you also
appreciate Ellen White. She has taken quite a lot of unfair criticism by people who do not
understand the interdependent interplay of the human and the Divine for the gift of Prophecy. (I
have a <a href=>blog post</a>
dedicated to Biblically proving her to have been right on key issues, and the very helpful
seminars/sermons/books of others are include there as well.

Thank you for the advice about the ‘sticking with the SDA Church’. I came to my decision,
(which was to allow my Home Church membership to be dropped upon me leaving Andrews
University and (back) moving to Canada), upon much pondering. It increasingly became evident
that things would just not get done as God expects them by the indifference and limitations in the
SDA Church. So I set out to establish a new organization. I was later most glad to see that EGW
actually deliberately left open this possibility of a “new denomination” ‘if/when there would be
an actual/tangible need to do so.’ (See the whole context of <a
href=>1SM 176-185</a>, cf. <a

href=>LDE 59-61</a>, <b>all discussed <a
on>here</a></b>). And there is indeed this need with the current SDA Church indifferent
impasse in regards to True Gospel work.

It is by faith-based actions to fully seek to still do Christ’s full will despite this apostasy that the
righteous in the Church will survive this, <a
currently going on/wrapping up Shaking.</a>

Relatedly, you may find the following related blog post helpful on this key/pivotal issue:

<b>The Latter Rain</b> - <a

<b>Ezekiel 8</b> - <a
<b>Ezekiel 9</b> - <a
<b>Christ’s (Full) Righteousness</b> - <a

<a href=>amongst others.</a>

<b>August 16, 2013 08:37 AM</b>

<b>Thank you [NJK] for all your research data. I will look at your references. I agree with
you completely that EGW was inspired by God in her writing. Understanding her history,
and coupling it with her body of work, indicates a miracle occurred. When actually reading
it, to me, the miracle is confirmed. She does write about the ship, the ice berg, and
passengers shaken. I'm sure you know about that vision. Indicates, the church. I am just
concerned about "leaning unto my own understanding..." I know the church has a lot of
things wrong, but Satan works feverishly here, so no wonder. I can not call it Babylon, even
though many Babylonians in it. I am enjoying your information, you have an insightful
mind. Your Sister in Christ, G.</b>

<b>August 16, 2013 01:19 PM</b>

<b>On The State, Standing and Fate of the Church</b>

You are welcome G. The proof of EGW’s connection to Christ/God is indeed in the substance of
her writings. It is interesting that a 2005 US-wide survey revealed that many (under 40) pastors
across all denominations cited her as <a
d-authors-that-have-most-influenced-pastors>one of their most influential authors.</a> As
presenter Mark Howard relates in one of his SOP seminars,<b>[1]</b> even an independent
non-SDA Lawyer who was hired in the 1980's to look into the common charge against her of
plagiarism, not only most objectively and factually cleared her of that charge, but also gave a
quite poignant testimony of how the copious reading he had done of her writings for that legal
task had actually Spiritually “moved” him!!

<b>[1]</b> I can’t relocate the exact one and its audio/video link from the listing provided in <a

I know there is much to go through and read on my blog, so perhaps these specific links to topics
which are most pertinent to the related raised issue(s) here could be of previewing convenience
(and also time-saving wise) for you.

To give you a little bit of pertinent contextualization background to my blog work/writing: The
foundation of my ministering life since 1997 has always involved trying to figure out why there
was such difference with what SDA teach and believe and also the great promises made to them,
and the various non-realizations in their experience and existence, and my deeper research has
always found the many places where what we believe, teach and practice are more “traditional”
than concrete and transparent truth. I first encountered this pivotal reality in trying to figure out
why not all Christians believed our presentation on Daniel’s 70 Week ‘since it was so exact,
incontrovertible and clear’ well upon undertaking that research,<b>[1]</b> I quickly saw that
behind the facade of our presentation, though my research resulted in showing that our dates
were correct, the reasons and proofs of fulfilling events and dates that we were giving we
actually full of errors and inaccuracies which most non-SDA’s were aware of...hence their <a
href=>rejection of
that key/foundational prophecy.</a> I since have found this to be the case with most of what we
thought. {Cf. e.g., <a
href=>here</a>}. I.e., they
all needed to be better proven. As EGW said, we were to “improve” the light of our fathers
putting what they Biblically discovered on the most possible sure and solid foundation. (1T
262.1) What was “surfacly” acceptable in the days of EGW is no longer so in our more Biblical
Scholarship advanced days. That I why focus in exegetically proving how the various “extra-
Biblical” that EGW had were actually always exegetically supported in the Bible.

<b>[1] See the <i>“Biblical Interpretation”</i> (starting from the summary): <a



[<i>Note:</i> The following section was subsequently expanded and reposted in <a
href=>this post</a> at
<b>Note #12</b>
Now, to this important issue about the 1904 Ship/Vessel-Iceberg-“Shaken” vision of EGW. It is
recorded in <a href=>1SM 205.2-206.3</a> &
<a href=>SpTB02 55.1-56.3</a>. It is found in
the context of a “new movement” trying to be formed by “sophistries” being introduced in the
SDA Church then, mainly in regards to John Harvey Kellogg’s teaching that there was no
Heavenly Sanctuary and his pantheistic theories. And in that vision, EGW was told to meet those
heresies (iceberg) head on. As she also said back in 1897, the Shaking would also come through
the introduction of such false theories/teachings in the Church (<a
href=>LDE 177.1</a>). So here she was
instructed to not let this occur, but to “Meet it” and so defeat it. The same thing should have been
going on in the SDA Church today with now, the many false practices which have been allowed
to enter the Church. Again the Church’s teachings are “fundamentally” Biblical, but the Church
has many widely accepted practices which certainly are not, and are literally self-hindering the
advancement of this Ship. Unlike in EGW’s day where there evidently were many others who
sided with Truth against the false theories then, today most of the Church leadership and
members either fully endorse those false practices or they are just indifferent to them. That “non-
meeting inaction” actually is conversely what results in the Church corporately not being able to
survive this Shaking (=<a href=>5T 210.3-
211.2ff</a>) for, like in EGW vision, it would have require strong, fact, powerful and
collective/corporate countering action to get through it.

So, from my Bible and SOP studies into this issue, the SDA Vessel here/now is actually quite
critically damage and is fatally taking on water. The “Church Militant”, i.e., even the faithful
“7000" ones (Rev 11:13) who had taken the battle field has defeated itself as the start of the
Ezek 37 actually was depicting. They can however join the ‘distinct’ Church Triumphant(LDE
61-62) , if they actually allow God, and in His way, to both <a
and Reform them.</a>

The SDA Church is indeed not Babylon, and that pointedly is because unlike Babylon, it is not
“confused”. It clearly knows what God’s Full Truth is. So it instead is God’s Jerusalem and
History has shown that God will not abstain from, even most severely, judging His Jerusalem if
it deserves it. (E.g., Jer 6-7; Luke 19:41-44), and even rejected and replaced (e.g., Rev 3:16;
LDE 59-61ff; cf. Rev 2:5). As I document in <a
on>this post</a> EGW herself knew that the SDA Church could become a “sister to fallen
Babylon” and even, through socio-economic injustices, like Sodom and Gomorrah (Ezek 16:48-
50; Isa 1:8-20) for that is what the present, <a

onDNA>Eschatological phase of Revelation Babylon</a> (Protestant-controlled America) <a
href=>is also



Final point: There is a very important Spiritual/Theological point to keep in mind from what God
stipulated in Jer 18:1-10. As EGW similarly said ‘all of God’s promises are upon condition of
obedience’ (COL 145.1) So whatever God has promised to the SDA Church is not set in stone,
indeed, relatedly, <a
href=>the future itself
is not set in stone</a>. So God can, and my view and experience is that He has long begun to,
replace the ‘indifferently, unzealously non-repentful’ (contra. Rev 3:18) SDA Church, and had
long given warnings through the SOP that this could become the actually transpired reality case.
(LDE 59-61). That is relatedly why the Second Coming was <a
href=>at least 3 times
postponed in the days of EGW</a>...because, as with rebellious Ancient Israel (cf. <a
href=>15MR 292.3-4</a>) the “conditions of
the ground” did not warrant the fulfillment the many, and quite specific promises made to that
generation. The same Divine conditional principle still applies today. (Jer 18:9-10)

Sorry for the length of this email. It is just that this pivotal is quite involved and I would not to it
justice by not summarily presenting it in as much of its substantiating/validating details as
possible. Of course, do see my blog post for much more.

May God guide your studies,

Likewise, your Brother in Christ,

April 29, 2018 20:59

Wow, I don't belong to the SDA, so I guess that leaves me out.
Jesus prayed to His (our) Father, that as He is ONE with Him (the Son), we would be ONE,
not just with Them, but with ALL believers. So I don't know if I and other non-SDA
believers are excluded, or that the Father and Son are ALSO excluded, since they may not
belong to the SDA???
Also, instead of looking at this event as merely a "vision", I suppose that the resurrection
that occurred at the Crucifixion/Resurrection of Christ, so was that a vision, also? It will be
nice when we can just believe Scripture for what it says rather that what we say it says.
In His prayer Christ pointed out that when we achieve that unity (Father/Son/ALL
believers), then we (corporately) will be seen by the world as truly the body of Christ. Sadly

our denominations, regardless of how close or far they are from the truth, the
denominational mindset does nothing more then destroy our Father's dream of UNITY in
Him. So maybe we should all join the SDA movement to achieve that?

May 15, 2018

<a href=>here</a>

1. [1] Through the dated and chronological way in which the book of Ezekiel was written, with
visions given over ca. 20 years, the prophesied events in Ezekiel 8-11 (ca. 593-2 B.C. (Ezek 1:1,
2; 8:1) vs. ca. 585 B.C for Ezek. 33ff (Ezek 32:1; 33:21)) manifestly did come to pass on Judah
in the ca, 588-586 B.C. siege and destruction by Babylon (see e.g., Jer 34:1ff; 39:1ff; 52:4ff).
This was a third and the most destructive siege on Judah by Babylon in which Jerusalem and the
Temple were captured and physically destroyed (see Jer 39:8) vs. the limited, mere “pillaging”
damage in the prior sieges and assaults.

2. [2] It is rightly understood that the mention of, accurately, “Har-Megiddo” (a.k.a.
Armageddon) in Rev 16:16 involves a major conflict, and this relatable allusion in Zech 12:11
(=2 Chr 35:20-25) can cast much light on that obscure eschatological mention/application. First
of all, unlike what is normative for a major war involving large and “sophisticated” armies, the
eschatological war does not take place in a “valley”, but involves a “mountain”. Secondly, the
context of Zech 12, which dovetails into the Divine Judgement of Chapter 13, doubly involves:
‘God warring against those who have assembled against Jerusalem’, but also ‘against those in
Jerusalem who are bringing/holding His people down’, namely the defective/deficient leaders.
The prime symbolism of this is seen in the fact that in that epic and memorable battle of 2 Chr
35, ultra good king Josiah had lost his life because he had refused to obey what was actually
God’s will and word. (2 Chr 35:20-22ff). So God’s main concern in this war, on top of also
bringing utter defeat to enemies of His Israel, was/(still) is to (a) preserve the house of David,
and (b) spare all those who are faithful in Jerusalem. In fact it is those “spared ones” who go on
to, almost supernaturally, inflict defeat upon Israel’s enemies (see Zech 12:8, 9; = Rev 11:13).
So the key here is to grasp what is meant by the opposite symbol of a “mountain” in Rev 16:16
vs. the expected/normative “valley”. (See in this post for the explanation of that symbol. See this
dedicated post, and in this post at its Rev 16:16 comments section, for the latest, and more, on

3. [3] In thematically prophetic relation to this post on the Two Witnesses, non-accidently with
one of them being representative of the Elijah work and his due, circumstancely made necessary,
complimentary Eschatological work (cf. here about Mal 4:4-6), it is commonly assumed that it
was God who told Elijah to tell Ahab that because of Israel’s waywardness in worship Baal, rain
was going to be withheld, and that for precisely a symbolically significant 3.5 years, however the

Biblical testimony (James 5:17; 1 Kgs 17:1ff, which is actually not contradicted by the Spirit of
Prophecy (SOP) (PK 119.1-121.2ff), both, i.e., combinedly, make it clear that it was Elijah
himself who initiated and/or, being Spiritually in tune (cf. Matt 18:18), indeed came in tune with
the already decreed, and to be carried out, “turn of events” here. In other words, Elijah, seeing
Israel’s waywardness, knew that the God of Heaven will surely not leave this unpunished, nor
reward it, and thus earnestly prayed that God fittingly punish Israel, and that pointedly in the
exact way of their waywardness, which was the thinking that their man-made/ascribed to
(foreign) god was responsible for their livelihood and more powerful, “at least in that regard”,
than the even professed “Creator” God of Heaven. Then, as it can be seen in the SOP account,
God would have responded to Elijah that it would indeed be just as he had requested and no rain
would indeed not be sent and he could go ahead and announce this to King Ahab. That would
also explain why Elijah was doubtful about his commission as he was traveling by fertile lands
(PK 121.2). If it was God who had initially told him this, then he likely would not be second
guessing God as he knew God would do this. But because it was him who had initiated that
request, perhaps he felt here that he may have asked for too much. However he went ahead in
faith because the God of Heaven had indeed ratified his punishment proposal. Indeed we find the
same themes in the “Eschatological Holding back of the Four Winds’ which were to cause
Bible/SOP Final Events to unravel. And that punishment came to take 3.5 years before it was
deemed complete, and that ended again at ‘Elijah’s relating word’, whenever it would be that
God would signal him to do so (1 Kgs 17:1b & 18:1). (So any prophetic use of this 3.5 years
period is intended to be allusive to this Elijah judgement and not, as popularly commonly
assumed, “half of a perfect/complete 7 years.”

4. [4] See the common, and latest, exegetically glib/surface SDA understanding of this prophecy
in this, late December 2010, sermon by Derek Morris for a GC Revival and Reformation Week
series. See also this similarly, exegetically glib recent (ca. March 19, 2011) sermon ([video]
[audio]) by Doug Batchelor on this prophecy. As both, stemming from various inculcated,
capitalistic/individualistic, artificial limitations, fail to recognize the real, and depth of, practical
and sectarian pivotal problems of the Church, they both fail to properly interpret and apply this
prophecy, settling for surface, spiritually vacuous/teethless and “wall plastering”,
understandings. (=Ezek 13:10-16)
On the other hand, see the February 2-5, 2012 ‘Revival and Latter Rain’ series preached
by Mark Howard on the Andrews University Campus, -priorly preached in May 2011 at Loma
Linda: Part 1 - Why Revival Waits, Part 2 - Revival of True Discipleship and Part 3 -
Preparing for Rain; which is the best exposition and exhortation on this issue which I have heard
from amongst SDA, pointedly because it is not ‘glossingly and indifferently, “watering-downly”
apologetic’ as other SDA attempts (typically) have been.