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On Saturday, March 13, 2004, Hondata held a tuning seminar at the Torrance Hilton in Los
Angeles. This was a free one day seminar meant primarily for existing and prospective
Hondata dealers, but also open to enthusiasts and others as long as space permitted.
Almost 40 people were present in the morning, fewer in the afternoon.
The seminar covered general Honda tuning concepts and the use of the Hondata
s200 system in the morning, and an introduction to the new Hondata K-Pro system in the
afternoon. The seminar was presented by Doug MacMillan who, together with his partner
Derek Stevens, owns Hondata. Doug was assisted throughout the presentation by Matt of
the Hondata staff.
Both MacMillan and Stevens are New Zealanders who relocated to the United States about
four years ago to start Hondata. MacMillan has racing experience and still holds the New
Zealand land speed record in a 1.6 liter class that he set with a B16 CRX. Now having small
children, MacMillan has pretty much given up racing and is concentrating on
the tuning of Honda ECUs. His partner Stevens holds a degree in commerce and is the
primary author of the Hondata ECU software. Matt is a tech support person who moved
from Arizona and has substantial tuningknowledge, both hands on and with the Hondata
software. Never having seen MacMillan (Hondata’s avatar on ClubRSX shows a Martian from
the movie “Mars Attacks!”) I didn’t know what to expect. Turns out MacMillan is an eloquent
man with a dry sense of humor, and much more reminiscent of a computer technologist
than of a road racer.
Seminar participants received a CD-ROM that contained the afternoon (but not the morning)
presentation in pdf format, a demo version of the s200 ROM Editor, a working version of the
s200 datalogger, a working version of the new K-Series ECU Manager, and a few video clips
that show the working of VTEC and such.
Goals of tuning:
- The overall goal should be having educated customers: they should know what to expect
and not have unrealistic expectations
- Reliability is important: what is safe and what isn’t, depending on the project
- Repeatability (know all the factors that affect it; synthetic gear oil, for example, takes
longer to warm up, water temp, air temp, etc.)
- Maximum power is really only “marketing power.” A complete tuning package also
includes easy starting, steady idling and good drivability.
- Road tuning is just as important as dyno tuning; the dyno only tells part of the story and
real world conditions are very different.
- Part throttle is very hard to tune (and also to sell as it takes much longer!)
- Tuning for economy/emissions. It IS possible to have BOTH power AND economy. Same
for emissions.
Some education:
- A road car is at WOT (Wide Open Throttle) only 0.1% of the time and part throttle 99.9%
of the time.
- Part throttle tuning takes much longer (and costs a lot more), but done right makes for
much better responsiveness and fuel economy. Some of the replacement chips out there
only go for WOT top power. Some of those chips are very specialized, offer
no ignition control, and generate error codes. Simply switching those codes off is not a good
thing. Doug said 80% of the non-Mugen chips are really just copies of Mugen chips.
- Psychology of VTEC: The VTEC “kick” really shouldn’t be there if the engine is well tuned.
Then the curve should be totally smooth. Interestingly, some people think the car with the
VTEC “kick” has more power when, in fact, it has less.
No! Acceleration depends on the power under the dyno curve. Higher peak power can
actually generate less acceleration than a car with less peak power. Torque matters! More
power between 3,000 and 6,000 is extremely important. The only time when that may be
different and peak power becomes an issue is in drag racing.
Reliability:
- Doug asked how high do people rev? Some said as high as 10,500. Doug said that this is
hardly ever needed as power drops off with most cams well below that. Hondata usually
sets the rev limit about 500 rpm past the power peak. That way when you shift you drop
back to a good high rev point, but one with lots of power left. How high should you rev?
That depends on the strength of the rods and pistons. And valve bounce can
damage pistons.
- Running rich/lean? Proper rich/lean tuning is extremely important. Interesting point
brought up by Matt: The Mugen thermostat and similar do not let engine ever warm up all
the way so that tuning gets because the engine keeps adding fuel.
- Ignition advance knock: If the spark is fired too soon, the piston is still coming up and the
flame front bops into the piston. That can mean broken rods, worn bearings, or blown head
gaskets. Sacrificing the last five or ten hp in a highly tuned engine will greatly increase
longevity.
- Knock: one problem is that knock sensor reporting to the computer is not very good and
the computer isn’t well equipped to accommodate. The knock sensor is actually a
microphone; you can put headphones on and hear the knocking and which cylinder knocks.
- Altitude: table columns 1-10 must be tuned for higher altitude operation (Doug went
through that quickly)
- Fuel pressure: Some people think higher fuel pressure is better. That is not always so. Low
pressure means cooler fuel, pump and injectors. Some pumps actually move lower volume
at higher pressure. Basically, higher fuel pressure does not appear what Hondata
recommends. 50-60 psi is the max Hondata recommends.
Dyno repeatability
- Water temperature should be 180-195 degrees, and use datalogging
- Gearbox must be warmed up, especially with synthetic oil
- Keep intake temperature consistent
- A plug here for the Hondata intake gasket (now available for makes other than just
Hondas). Intake manifold is aluminum and heats up when it really should be cool.
The intake manifoldis NOT a heat sink and the gasket does NOT hurt. Bypassing the heating
on the throttle body (which some people do) amounts to perhaps 20% of the lowered
temperature and the Hondata intake gasket 80%.
- Turn off the knock sensor and switch to open loop.
Road tuning
- Dyno is different from road and different dynos load the engine differently
- Underhood airflow is different between dyno and road tuning
- WOT air/fuel seems richer on a dyno than on the road
- G sensor can measure horsepower during road tuning
Knock
- The knock sensor is a tuned microphone. You can build one from a speaker amp ($30).
- A knock processor will retard ignition by 12 degrees when it detects a knock, then adds 1
degree per second until it bumps into knocking again
- Knock sounds like a sharp ticking
Injectors
- Use saturated injectors (12 ohms) like the new 440 and 550s from RC Engineering
- 550 cc injectors at 50psi fuel pressure can handle approximately 320-350 whp
- The Honda stock fuel pump is good for 250-290 whp
Tuning procedure
- Take your Helms service manual
- Set ignition timing to stock
- Set VTEC high (7000) and tune WOT and part throttle
- Set VTEC low (2000) and repeat WOT and part throttle
- Set the VTEC crossover RPM
- (Note: this was covered much too quickly)
Doug mentioned Erick’s Racing 9.99 second ¼-mile Civic that has 300+ wheel hp on a 2.2
liter engine with the stock ignition and 10,500 rpm limit.
Note: Hondata’s s200 system does not pertain to the RSX. It is for older Honda engines.
However, using the s200 is fairly similar to using the new K-Series ECU Manager software,
and a lot of the principles and settings discussed by Doug apply to the K-Series as well.
The Hondata ROM Editor lets you manipulate the fuel and ignition tables built into
a Honda ECU. You can then upload a new or modified calibration into the ECU.
Data can be viewed either as a table, a 2D graph or a 3D graph. The rows in those tables
represent engine rpm and columns represent engine load measured in
pressure. Honda ECUs have separate ignition and fuel tables (and the K-Series also has cam
angle tables) for the low and the high speed cams. The ROM Editor therefore lets you toggle
between low and high speed cam tables. Note that low cam and high cam maps have
different resolution and scaling. Even within a cam table, rpm differences between rows in
the table are not always the same. The overall idea is to tweak values in cells or “tuning
positions.”
You start by loading a map for a particular car. Start with one that has the most similar
components as the motor you use. Some stock maps have settings for a particular feature,
like an intake manifold with specific characteristics.
How do you edit data points in the table? You can change individual values. Or you can
change a bunch of values all at once. Or you can select a bunch of points and then use an
“interpolate points” feature. That comes in handy when a curve is rough and needs to be
smoothed out. Or you can select all points of the table and advance everything by a couple
of degrees and see what it does on the dyno.
Once all the desired changes are made the modified maps can be saved under a descriptive
name and uploaded into the ECU.
Doug then demonstrated the injector sizing calculator. They allow you to set
larger injector size, different fuel pressure and then scale the tables accordingly. He said
that the K-Series runs a wide-band oxygen sensor which allows for more accurate
recording.
Supercharged cars love low VTEC points, but that is not always desirable for daily driving,
so the ROM Editor allows you to set the VTEC point so that it comes on, but ONLY at certain
amount of boost (“boost-activated VTEC”). Else, the VTEC would come off and on and off
and on during part throttle driving, which is very bad for economy. Doug said Hondata can
set dry nitrous systems on and off automatically, depending on certain conditions. He said
that nitrous is very efficient. You can get far more power from 440 injectors with nitrous
than from a supercharger. Or you can use nitrous to cool the intake charge or to
reduce turbo lag. Or set it so that it won’t spray under certain speeds or above certain revs.
Under Options you can turn off certain sensors which certain ECUs may not have. Under
Notes you can describe what you did/changed and other particulars about a chip.
Target Lambda is the air/fuel ratio you want to achieve using a wideband meter wired into
the oxygen sensor. You datalog, then load the run and analyze. If it shows too rich or too
lean in areas, you select those and then add or subtract fuel via a dialog box. One view
shows duty cycle on selected injectors in percent. That way you can see if your injectors are
adequate. Note: Stock oxygen sensors cannot be used for accurate datalogging! Also note
that K-Series Oxygen sensor measures current not voltage and A/F gauge will NOT work on
it, and even mess things up.
- Interesting: air scoops and ram air should be low on car as swoopy hood and top increases
air speed and thus lowers pressure, just as on an airplane wing. For best ram charging the
scoop should be underneath.
- A G-Sensor can be added inside the s200 box for acceleration figures.
- MAP sensor can show you how your air intake is doing. If there is too much of a vacuum,
you need more air (à CAI).
- One of the obvious pros in the audience referred to the “infamous hesitation issue” – That
was Honda code relating to emission controls. Revision 37 of ROM fixed it. Apparently you
can download new ROM revs from Hondata’s website
- Note that the rev limiter does NOT keep engine from over-revving during a misshift.
- Starting/cranking is in upper right part of the data table. Do not have much advance
there, perhaps even zero or less.
- Honda ignition timing is very conservative to accommodate for very poor fuel.
Hondata uses the PLX wideband sensor (www.plxdevices.com) or the more expensive XJL
(FJL?) for datalogging and road tuning.
The Hondata K-Pro system consists of an added circuit board to the standard ECU, the K-
Series ECU Manager software, and a number of preconfigured calibration maps. How is it
different from the Hondata reflash? The reflash is a one-shot recalibration of the ECU
whereas the K-Pro is programmable and can recalibrate the ECU again and again. Whereas
the Hondata initially tuned their static ECU reflashes for what was available at the time, i.e.
basic header, AEM CAI, etc., the K-Pro, written by Derek Stevens, can be used
for tuning and finetuning any supported vehicle with all sorts of add-ons. The initial product
is for the US K-Series Type-S, but Hondata is also working on a K-Pro for the Civic Si and
for European market Civic Type Rs.
Unlike the s200 system, K-Pro does programming and datalogging all in one. It has
integrated wideband to take advantage of the Type-S’s wideband sensor. Doug feels the K-
Pro is the best engine computer programming system, period. Uploading is
via USB port that gets installed in the stock ECU in addition to a daughterboard that
contains the interface to the HondaECU. You can even upload a new map into the ECU while
the car is running. It burbles a bit, then resumes.
What did Hondata find as they analyzed the RSX Type-S ECU?
- Runs very rich at high rpm
- Has conservative ignition timing, tuned for low emission at high mileage.
- VERY sensitive to the knock sensor (could explain dyno power differences in stock Type-S
engines
- Once tuned, more power, same or better emission, better economy.
K-Series ECU Manager software: frequently check for updates as there’s one every few
days.
The initial download of the ECU software from a car takes 30 seconds or so and the car can’t
run while doing it. Uploads of calibrations, however, only takes a few seconds and can be
done while running. Here Doug mentioned that the Honda ECU has a backup processor that
allows you to limp home even if the main processor fails (maybe the backup takes over
while the new calibration is loaded?)
Doug emphasized that the cam angle is the most important aspect of tuning the K-
Series engine. About 2500 dyno runs form the basics of the current software and maps.
The K-Series ECU Manager software has datalogging built-in. ROM Editor and Datalogger
are combined here, but for now the software only has graphs and tables, and not the dials
and other representations found in the s200 software.
Doug then went through some of the settings of the software. For example,
- Multiplexer off – temp gauge and some others will not display.
- Immobilizer can be turned off (not recommended)
- Fuel trim: #3 cylinder typically runs a bit hotter so you can add fuel
- For tuning, turn off closed loop because you want to be in open loop.
- Knock: you can set it so that MIL light flashes whenever it knocks. “K Count” is in
the Sensors list and shows how often computer felt the engine knocked. Knock is a stored
value, long-term. You can go see where the knocks occur and then see if the AF ratio is
okay. If so, then check ignition advance. There can be dozens or hundreds of knock counts
in a second (zoom in to see closely).
While the variable cam timing is terrific for tuning, having a constantly moving cam also
means that it takes a longer time to tune all this. Doug explained that when tuning a car
and developing the optimal calibrations, they actually do dynos at each angle (I think) then
see where the cam likes to be for best power at each rpm.
Doug briefly talked about extreme cams. There are no really wild cams for the K-Series yet,
but there are experimental ones that Hondata checked out. Add lots of timing at low end for
impressive torque gains, raise idle speed, reduce overlap in part throttle.
Supercharged engines:
- Tuning is really similar to NA larger motor.
- It loves overlap.
- Cam angle affects boost in manifold
- Low cam VTC 45-50 degrees
- High cam VTC 50 degrees and then down to 40 from 7000 rpm on up
- The higher the RPM, the higher the boost. (Greddy turbo actually got less boost at
higher RPM)
- However, more boost does not necessarily mean more power
- Street JRSC had 212-220 whp, went up to around 250 with Hondata.
Example of Greddy turbo K-Pro tuning on a Type-S showed 50 hp gain over simple e-
manage “patches.”
Nitrous:
Doug said the use of nitrous was much safer with the K-Pro. He recommended a
dry system. Wet nitrous system not a very happy match with Type S because at redline
Type S cuts off fuel whereas nitrous continues, instantly leaning things to catastrophic
levels. Nitrous works quite well with boosted engines. They get higher boost (by about 0.5
psi) and the supercharger acts as a nitrous mixer. Hondata tried a JRSC with 7 PSI and
N2O. The nitrous dry system added boost but they found the belt slipping at
high RPM (Doug runs DC twin canister exhaust and 7psi on his car). Ignition should be
retarded, the system needs larger injectors, and nitrous should be shot off before redline.
With turbo engines, nitrous can reduce turbo lag by spooling up the turbine more quickly.
Intake manifolds:
Doug showed some dyno runs of stock Type-S versus the Integra Type
R intake manifold which has slightly fatter runners, and so should do better. However, the
horsepower difference is primarily at the high end.
Hondata added almost 20 hp on top, AEM CAI another 10, Greddy catback added a bit, ITR
cams another 15 hp. Raceheaders from Comptech added yet another 15 up to almost 230.
ITR manifold added a bit of high-end. Titanium exhaust and pulleys added a few. Finally
they installed a ported big valve head with Toda cams, for a result of almost 250 whp. A
Hytech exhaust, 12:1 pistons, cams and intake raised that figure up to 270.
Another project (Hasport/Jackson Racing Civic Type R) replaced the K20A2 bottom with a
K24 CRV bottom. This brought 40 pounds extra torque, but power dropped off quicker at
the high end. Initial peak power was 210 whp. They added an 8psi JRSC and got torque of
over 230 foot-pounds and over 290 whp.
Doug said they also have what he called a “Show Car Special” K-Pro. It comes with flashing
blue LEDs (which do absolutely nothing but flash) and a clear plastic case for twice the
price.
K-Series Bang-for the buck list of mods:
- Intake Gasket
- CAI
- ECU Reflash
- Header/Exhaust
- K-Pro and tuning
- Nitrous and/or boost
- Cams
- K24 bottom end swap
At what point should one go from the Hondata reflash to the K-Pro?
Doug seems to think primarily when you get into more serious mods.
Are there plans for a G-Sensor like the one available for the s200?
Not a high priority.
They fit a JRSC to a base! Cables on throttle body are reversed on base. They turned the
whole thing around. Sounds like it’s just a theoretical project.
What’s that big black chip on the upper left of the ECU?
That controls the wideband oxygen sensor. It’s almost its own computer. Doug says it took
them almost a year to figure out what it was.
Hondata Notes
Myth Busters
• Performance wise, backpressure is never a good thing.
• Cold Air Intakes work well, opt for plastic instead of metal. Metal intakes conduct heat.
AEM V2 intakes are good because of the Resonance Point and also the heat shield.
• Headers decrease backpressure and are great to tune on RSX motors because you can
set valve overlap for cylinder scavaging.
• A good exhaust system also helps decrease the backpressure.
• Mugen Chips disable most error codes so problems won’t get detected. They run
extremely rich and can cause damage to engine.
• JET charges $300 for a sticker on the chip inside your ECU
o The processor inside of OBD 2 ECUs is read only, non reprogrammable
• VTEC should be a very smooth transition. VTEC feels faster when it “kicks” because a
person is better at feeling an instant change in horsepower than an overall increase in
horsepower.
• Peak horsepower isn’t nearly as important to going fast as average horsepower.
o Peak Horsepower is the highest point on the graph
• Average horsepower is the area under the entire graph
• Stock Honda fuel pumps can support up to 400 hp at stock rail pressure
o They can only support 200 hp at 75 psi. rail pressure
o FMUs and Aftermarket Fuel pressure regulators can raise fuel pressure to 75+ psi. This is
why aftermarket fuel pumps have to be used in conjunction with an FMU.
o FMUs also overwork injectors and fuel pump, causing them to heat the fuel, and
decreasing their lives.
• High Octane fuel doesn’t vaporize immediately; it will melt pistons on
the exhaust stroke. Always use the lowest octane possible for your application to ensure
complete combustion.
Miscellaneous
• Part Throttle tuning is very important and hard to do. Most street cars spend 99.9% of
their lives at part throttle.
• Part Throttle Tuning results in overall better gas mileage.
o A turbocharged GS-R can retain 33 mpg fuel economy when part throttle is properly
tuned.
Dyno Tuning Procedure with Hondata
• Set distributor to stock setting (16 degrees on B series)
• Disable closed loop.
• Set fuel pressure to stock.
• Tune low VTEC first (Refer to VTEC tuning)
• Make sure water temp is between 180-195 degrees according to the ECU
o There are two coolant temperature sensors on B series, one for ECU and one for gauge.
• Let Transmission warm up.
• Watch Intake Air Temperature, keep it consistent.
o Hondata intake manifold gasket keeps manifold temperatures consistent
o Heat transfers very quickly from the aluminum intake manifold to the air going into
the engine. Run car at 3000 RPM for 10 seconds to cool intake manifold before dyno run.
• When tuning, use computer to disable knock sensor. Knock sensor can and will
retard ignition timing causing false readings.
• For Naturally Aspirated cars, ideal Air/Fuel ratio at Wide Open Throttle is 13.0 – 13.5
• For Forced Induction cars, ideal Air/Fuel ratio at Wide Open Throttle is 11.5-12.5
• 10% change in fuel will change A/F Ratio about 1 point.
• Listen for knock; don’t rely on stock B series knock sensor.
• Fuel Curve will be shaped very similarly to the torque curve.
o The most fuel will be needed at peak torque
o Remove fuel after peak torque
o On K-Series engines, 5+ horsepower can be realized by removing fuel from the top end.
o However, if the car is made of long distant high speed driving, more fuel will increase
reliability. (That is why Honda put the fuel there in the first place)
• When tuning for emissions, add 5 degrees timing between 1200-3500 rpm, use
launch control to heat cat.
• When using ROM Editor, always check for newest versions of ROM files. (File, Convert
Rom)
• Numbers on fuel map represent how much fuel is delivered per revolution
(Representative of Injector Duration).
• Restrictive intakes cause torque (fuel) to drop out at higher RPMs.
o Watch map sensor value at high RPM to see if it goes into vacuum.
o By installing a better flowing intake, more air can be crammed in the cylinder and
therefore more fuel will be needed at higher RPMs. This will increase high end
performance.
• Forced Induction vehicles generally have flat fuel (torque) curves.
• Fuel curves in 2D mode should be flat not bumpy. They should never intersect. Usually a
4-2-4 ratio. 4 lines on bottom, 2 in middle, 4 on top. Boost curved will be very flat and
smooth.
VTEC Tuning
• Tune low VTEC maps first, then tune high VTEC maps
o Set VTEC very high (7000) then set VTEC low (3000)
Nitrous Tuning
• Dry kits are easier to tune with Hondata than wet kits.
• Begin tuning by adding a lot of fuel and measure air/fuel ratio. Cut back fuel until ideal
air/fuel ratio is achieved.
• On cars where rev limit is fuel based wet nitrous systems can provide enough fuel to
keep the engine spinning beyond the redline, but not enough to do this safely.
The engine can lean out and severely damage your car. To prevent this, set the nitrous to
shut off before hitting the redline.
Data Logging
• Rom Editor has 10 channel data logging across top of screen.
• Hondalogger has 40 channels of data logging
• Map sensor drop off because of Ventury effect or restrictive intake. Plug map
sensor close to the #4 intake. Bigger throttle body, non restrictive intake.
• Intake manifold acts as a big heat sink. Disperses heat into the intake air. Hondata
gasket reduces intake air temperature, gives more part throttle power because air in
the manifold is colder and denser.
• Clean IAT sensor. Sometimes can get covered in oil.
• Ram air effect measured by map sensor.
• Hondalogger can read long and short term fuel trim. Also can log multiple recordings in
one file.
• Fuel trim is dependant on O2 sensor. Make sure you have a good O2 sensor after you
are finished tuning. Fuel trim gets screwed up with bad O2 sensor
• Don’t run injectors past 80% duty cycle.
• IAT sensor adjusts fuel.
• Wideband
• Can plug in numbers for LSU sensor.
Auto tune
• Good tuners don’t use auto tune. Requires a set amount of time at each RPM.
K-series Tuning
• Look up cam angle, then look at ignition at that cam angle, then look at fuel at that cam
angle.
• To do high cam, set all cam angles to 50, then tune fuel and ignition. Ignition doesn’t
change much; fuel can change up to 10% between all maps.
• When engine is cold, cam is set to fully retarded position. Takes 10 seconds from start
for engine warm up procedures to take effect and for cam to unlock.
• .5 degree per click for ignition timing for K series, .25 degree per click for OBD 1
• RSX wideband is very accurate.
• Don’t let anyone believe that setting VTC (cam timing) at one fixed point will help
anything. (VTC killer cam gear)
• Set Closed loop to 110 kPa for boost
• Honda doesn’t trust Americans to put good fuel in their cars, so they tune for crap fuel.
• Increase overlap accordingly; see VTC and Turbo, NA and SC.
• Honda planned for 3-2 shifts by tuning the exhaust springs.
• Retard for emissions, advance for power.
• With header and intake, advance cam timing 5-10 degrees.
• Overlap allows for header to pull air throw intake and into cylinder.
• Cam and Camcmd is a sensor that tells the ECU where the cam is.
• Put cam at maximum advance when VTEC engages.
• Take baffle out of exhaust before dyno tune.
• Bracketing, raise cam timing (+5), and then lower it (-5), see at what points you gain
and lose horsepower.