Interview with Morihiro Saito (2)

by Stanley Pranin
Aiki News #33 (March 1979)
Available Languages:
The following article was prepared with the kind assistance of Volker Hochwald of Germany.
It is the second installment of a three-part interview with Morihiro Saito, 8th dan Sensei of the
Ibaraki Dojo in Iwama, Japan. Saito Sensei continues his description of O-Sensei's teaching
method during the post-war years in Iwama.

Screen shot from 1973 video

Saito Sensei : During practice O-Sensei would teach the techniques he had developed up to
that point as if systematizing and organizing them for himself. If we started doing suwari
waza (seated techniques), we would continue doing that only, one after another. The sempai
(senior students) and kohai (junior students) would practice together and the kohai would take
ukemi (breakfalls). When the sempai finished the right and left sides and the kohai's turn
came it was already time for the next technique. Practice in those days was not easy. I used to
review the day's practice with Mr. Goro Narita, Yuichi's uncle, on the road in the middle of the
rice fields on our way to the Joban line (railway line in Ibaraki Prefecture.) If we practiced a
long time it took as long as two hours to get to the station. It was my free practice. When we
would study one technique we would systematically learn related techniques. As I also think
that this is the right method, I don' t teach favorite techniques in an unsystematic manner. I
always teach only related techniques. In this way, students also can learn techniques in an
organized manner and when they teach they will be effective. If they practice
unsystematically they can't teach in an organized way. Also, O-Sensei taught us two, three or
four levels of techniques. He would begin with kata, then one level after another, and finally,

it became just so... and now I teach in exactly the same way. It's not good to teach only flashy
techniques in order to be regarded as a great teacher. It doesn't matter if you' re not flashy.
Those who don' t want to practice don' t have to come. So Aikido isn't something we should
solicit people to practice by saying: "Come and join us." It's not something to be publicized.
Those who want to practice come and we all practice together. That' s why I say we shouldn't
overdo it in urging people to come. Those who don' t have a strong will will hinder others.
They hinder those who practice earnestly. Because O-Sensei taught us systematically I've got
to teach in an organized way, too. In the prewar period he taught without explanation.
Students couldn't ask questions. He only demonstrated throws. But I was taught from morning
till evening and he would say: "That's not the way. Every little detail should be correct.
Otherwise it isnt a technique. See, like this... like that!" Those are the "kuden" (oral
teachings) I wrote down. So if I have a problem in doing a certain technique I remember what
I was told by O-Sensei and then it works fine. Thats why I regard these words as superb
secrets, in other words "kuden". So I wrote my books as oral teachings. In olden times, the
instructions were secret and secretly handed down. It was alright that they were kept secret.
Secrets were necessary. However, in Aikido today, secrets are not necessary. Since the
Founder said that we wish to spread this Aikido correct Aikido I would like to improve
as fast as possible, even by one day. Also, though he didnt have many students at that time,
O-Sensei used to throw everyone at least once. So I also touch everyone, though it would be
impossible to do so if there were tens of thousands of students, at least in "Tai no henko" and
"kokyuho". I don't know whether I can call it my philosophy, but to my way of thinking, a
family-like life such as this is necessary and that without actually touching and skin-to-skin
contact true Aikido can neither be understood nor taught. I don't think it will work well if a
teacher says. "Do it like this!. or "Thats no good!" speaking down to the students. In my case
my explanation during class is quite lengthy. Though everyone was intelligent, I wasnt and I
had a hard time in learning. So, when I see a student who is moving incorrectly I stop him and
tell him: "Your movement is not quite right. Its better this way." or "You should do it like
this." And without explanation during the class everyone gets tired. Since I want to give them
a chance to rest and also I want their technique to become perfect even one day sooner, I
frequently give explanations during class. I cant speak well and I dont have much talent, so I
can't do as well as I wish. I was very lucky O-Sensei taught me thoroughly in detail, and I'm
following his example. When I accompanied Sensei on a trip I was tested by everyone, though
they weren't impolite to the Founder. Once, when we went to Osaka the whole class consisted
of fourth or fifth-dan judoists. You see, my arms were so skinny. So they teased me and tested
me.
Editor: Your arms were skinny? (laughter)
Saito Sensei: After the war when Mr. Minoru Mochizuki opened a dojo in Shizuoka
Prefecture O-Sensei was invited and I accompanied him. There, I entered the bath to wash OSenseis back and he looked at me and said: "Saito, you are skinny!" After this happened, I
want to the maintenance department of the JNR (Japanese National Railway where Saito
Sensei was working at that time) and borrowed a rail which was one meter long and weighed
81 pounds. As there were no barbells, I used the rail....but now I have pain in my legs and I
can't do anything. Anyway, the Founders teaching method was perfect. He taught so that
anybody could understand and remember. Pre-war Aikido wasnt the true one remember he
was ordered to do what he did by the military he used to say that his post-war Aikido was
the true one....In any case, as O-Senseis instruction was sound, I preserve it in my teaching.
But I think I should study more and teach more kindly and politely. I will try to do so....

It is said that when O-Sensei came to Iwama during the war he underwent a profound
spiritual change. Would you tell us how O-Sensei changed during that
important period and also what influence it had on the development of Aikido?
Saito Sensei: I dont know such details. What I do know is the following: Toward the end of
the war, the military finally became aware of the fact that Japan couldnt win the war by
teaching Judo (to soldiers). Dr. Soichi Sakuta, President of Kenkoku University in Manchuria
said, "We cant win the war with Judo. Teach Aikido instead." Then, Mr. Kenji Tomiki
became the Aikido shihan of Kenkoku University. Also, in the Naval Academy at Edajima
they decided that Judo was inadequate and changed to Aikido. They discussed who would be
a suitable shihan there and thought that Akasawa-no-sabu (nickname) would be good. Mr.
Akasawa was at that time fighting on the Pacific front aboard the ship "Akishima." O-Sensei
was influential enough to have him recalled to Edajima with a telegram from military
headquarters. So Mr. Akasawa came back to Edajima and I heard he just ate and slept and ate
and slept in order to get his body back into shape. Then, soon the war ended. O-Sensei had
said, "Aikido has finally been recognized. The young officers of the army and navy are slack.
Weve got to reeducate them. But we dont have a suitable place for this. We should build an
outdoor dojo. Without retraining the young officers in an outdoor dojo theres no way we can
expect to win the war. We cant win the war by requiring them to learn Judo and Kendo. They
have to learn Aikido basics according to the Aikido method." When he found this place
(Iwama) for the outdoor dojo and the dojo was built, the war ended. Thats all I know. Beyond
that I dont have any idea about the psychological change in O-Sensei caused by the social
situation. What I have just told you is what I know and I heard it clearly (from O-Sensei.)
Close to the end of the war, the military finally judged that our country would lose the war if
we practiced Judo. At least at the Naval Academy they thought so. Before that, O-Sensei used
to teach at the Nakano Military School, the Army University, the Naval University, Toyama
University and the Military Police School, he taught for more than ten years. After it was
decided that Judo was inadequate, the Kenkoku University in Manchuria also changed to
Aikido. However, when the war ended it was prohibited to train in the martial arts, to possess
a sword, or a gun, or a knife with a blade longer than 7 centimeters. Under such
circumstances, when O-Sensei was trying his best to keep the seed of Aikido alive here, I
happened to become his student. There were a lot of sempai but they all grew up and left.
They all returned to their own homes, entered companies, returned to their families, or got
jobs. If their family had a dojo they inherited that, etc. In the end, only a small number of
sempai from around here and myself were left. But all the sempai from this area ended up not
being able to come to the dojo after getting married because they had to work hard at their
occupations.... Whenever Sensei was here we couldnt tell when he would call to us. Even if
we asked for the neighbors help in threshing rice, that very day, if Sensei said, "Come!" and
we didnt, the result was terrible. So everybody ended up unable to come to the dojo in order
to maintain their own families. I could continue because I was free during the daytime though
I went to work every other evening. I could live without receiving any money from O-Sensei
because I was paid by the JNR. O-Sensei had money but students around here didnt. If they
came to Sensei they would have had no income and not have been able to raise rice for their
families and would have died by coming to the dojo. All of them gradually stopped coming. I
could continue because I had money enough to live. I was lucky enough to have a job,
otherwise, I wouldnt have been able to continue. As I was of some use to him, O-Sensei
willingly taught me everything. It was extremely severe. It was only to those students who
served him at the risk of their lives, even though it was only for budo, helping him, from
morning to evening in the fields getting dirty and massaging his back that O-Sensei opened
his heart.

to be continued
(transcribed by Kaori Fujisaki; translated by Stanley A. Pranin and Midori Yamamoto.)