LETS TALK

ABOUT THE
BARRIERS
By Susie Gilbert & Reema Patel
Because disability rights are human rights
You cant just get policy change. You cant just ask ministers
or shadow ministers to pledge things. First they have to
understand what is wrong and what needs to be changed.
(Sue Marsh, Disability Campaigner)
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 2
ABOUT THE FABIAN WOMENS NETWORK
The Fabian Womens Network exists as a thriving network for
women to achieve social and political change and to participate
in public life. It has a historic and long-standing link with Fabian
parliamentarians as a wing ofthe Fabian Society, Britains oldest
left of centre political thinktank.
61 Petty France
London SW1H 9EU
www.fabians.org.uk
Published September 2014


DISABILITY LABOUR
Disability Labour is an afliate of the Labour Party. It exists to
represent and support the interests of disabled Labour Party
members and supporters. Disability Labour plays a crucial role in
promoting the participation of disabled people within the Labour
Party, and campaigning to break down the barriers they face.


LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 3
About the authors
Susie Gilbert has spent most of her working life researching
and editing twentieth century history and was the main
researcher for the ofcial biography of Winston S. Churchill.
She has published two books on arts institutions.Opera for
Everybody, a history of English National Opera, was published
in 2009 and was runner up in the Theatre Book Prize, 2010.
She is a Labour party activist in Holborn and St Pancras, where
she is Chair of her local branch, Gospel Oak. She started
volunteering at Camden Citizens Advice Bureau in 2010. Her
particular concerns are the privatisation and cuts to public
services and the resulting disintegration of the social security
system, the growing problems faced by disabled and mentally
unwell people and the increase in personal debt all of which
she encounters at the CAB.
ReemaPatel is a Labour councillor in the London Borough of
Barnet and was a nalist for the Sheila McKechnie Foundations
London Social Justice campaign award for her work campaigning
for her local library, of which she is now a trustee.She works
for a think-tank, the New Local Government Network, and has
a background in local government project management. She
has written for a range of publications including the Fabian
Review, The Guardian, and the New Statesman on public policy
issues including public services, adult social care, housing, local
government and feminism. Reema is also a trustee of the National
Deaf Childrens Society, Secretary of the Fabian Womens
Network and the treasurer of Disability Labour.










LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 4
CONTENTS
Editorial 5

Speakers and Chair on panel 7
1 What are the barriers? 9

2 Barrier 1 : A Damaging Narrative 11
3 Barrier 2: Employment Getting Into Work
and Staying In Work 15
4 Barrier 3: The Social Security System and
Challenges, including the Work Capability Assessment 19

5 Barrier 4: The Impact of Austerity and Cuts to Benets 24
6 Barrier 5: Design, Planning and Physical Access 27
7 Barrier 6: Social Barriers Ambition for
Independent living 29
8 Summary of Ideas 32
9 Conclusion 35

LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 5
Editorial

This pamphlet has been drawn out from the discussion at the
event held by the Fabian Womens Network on the 16
th
July
2014 at which we raised the questions: What are the barriers
for disabled people to social and economic inclusion and how
can they be overcome?
The event provided an accessible environment in which disabled
people, their carers, advisers, politicians, advocates and a
number of disability rights organisations and campaigners could
debate the urgent questions being posed by the political, social
and economic climate of the day.
There was a consensus at the meeting that disability rights are
not being treated as a human rights issue and that they need to
be considered within a human rights context. The struggles and
challenges faced by the disability rights movement now parallel
those faced by many other successful civil rights movements
many years ago in terms of the need for a change in attitudes,
legislation and practice.
There is a need for our policy makers to examine what their
attitudes and their systems communicate to wider society about
the value we place on all citizens disabled or otherwise, and
especially on those who are vulnerable, sick and ill. We also need
to examine what these attitudes and systems communicate about
the worth we place on carers and those they care for. This is a
debate about the intrinsic value that human beings have regardless
of their physical and economic contributions to society and is
therefore a debate about human rights and social justice.
The purpose of this leaet is to crystallise the diversity of views
and voices expressed at the event into core themes and to
highlight the urgency of the need for a change in attitudes and
systems that are not only badly failing disabled people but are
also turning back the clock on the progress made in the last
decade under the Labour government of 1997 - 2010.
It is clear that genuine and substantive political leadership in this
area means building on the good work already achieved, and
recognising that the Labour Party will play a role in changing
the narrative about disabled people. It is important that we talk
about disabled peoples intrinsic worth, including their potential
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 6
to contribute to society in a meaningful way, together with their
right to be recognised as equal citizens in a modern British state,
free from the constraints of prejudice and discrimination.
The discussion on the 16th July 2014 raised the very important
point that disability is an issue that stretches across a range
of portfolio areas in government, not just one. Many of the
issues raised touch upon public health and mental health, social
care and the value of carers, the role of civic society and the
community and early intervention and prevention. Consequently
there was a consensus amongst many of those present that
disability policy and its implementation should not be conned
specically and exclusively to the Department for Work and
Pensions.
It is important for disabled people to be represented and
advocated for across a range of central government departments,
as well as at the local level.
We are conscious that the issues relating to disability are
complex and that there is always more to add to the discussion.
This pamphlet is therefore intended to provide the basis for that
further discussion. That is why we have sought, rst, to ask what
the barriers are and to dene them as well as is possible, and
second to understand how best they can be overcome.
We hope that the conversation FWN facilitated raises a range of
issues that will feed into Labour Party policy in the run-up to the
General Election and beyond. Disability Labour as well as the
Fabian Society as the oldest afliated think tank to the Labour
Party will play a vital role in shaping that.
The Fabian Womens Network would like to thank the
executive committee of Disability Labour for their support of this
publication.
Susie Gilbert (Executive Committee Member, Fabian Womens
Network) and Reema Patel (Executive Committee Member, Fabian
Womens Network and Disability Labour).
7 September 2014.
The views expressed in this publication are those of the speakers
and writers alone, and do not represent the collective position of
either the Fabian Womens Network, or the Fabian Society.
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 7
The speakers on the panel

Kate Green MP for Stretford and Urmston Elected in May
2010 Kate is currently Shadow Spokesperson for Disabled
People. Prior to her election Kate was Chief Executive of the
Child Poverty Action Group, and before that Director of the
National Council for One Parent Families (now Gingerbread).
She is a long-standing campaigner against poverty and
inequality, chairs the all-party parliamentary group on poverty,
and serves as a member of the Greater Manchester Poverty
Commission.
Emily Holzhausen, Director of Policy and Public Affairs,
Carers UK is responsible for Carers UKs strategic development
and delivery of policy, research, campaigning, parliamentary
and media work. She is one of the UKs foremost experts on
carers issues during her 18 years at Carers UK she has
commissioned or conducted over 30 pieces of research on
carers lives and led campaigns delivering landmark new rights
for carers.
Sue Marsh, campaigner, writer, journalist and blogger
campaigns to raise awareness of hidden disabilities and long-
term illness. A sufferer of severe Crohns Disease for nearly three
decades, Sue Marsh set up the blog Diary of a Benet Scrounger
to raise awareness of life with a chronic illness and has been
the driving force behind two important reports on disability and
social security.
1
Tom Pollard, Policy and Campaigns Manager for the Social
Inclusion and Rights team at the mental health charity Mind.
Pollard has worked at Mind since 2010 in various roles, where
his team works on issues around access to justice, benets and
welfare, and human rights and equality. Tom has co-chaired the
Disability Benets Consortium (a coalition of over 60 charities), is
the co-ordinator of the Campaigns Forum, and sits on the steering
group of the Who Benets? campaign.
1 Responsible Reform: A Report on the Proposed Changes to
Disability Living Allowance, and Beyond the Barriers : ESA,
The Work Programme and Recommendations for a New System
of Support
htp://www.spartacusnetwork.org.uk/index.php/esa
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 8
Claudia Wood, Chief Executive of Demos. Woods primary
research interests are health and social care, public service
markets and personalisation, ageing, disability and benefits
reform. She authored the Destination Unknown longitudinal
report series, following six disabled households through welfare
reform and service cuts, and carried out a cumulative impact
assessment of welfare reform on disabled people. She has
written extensively on ESA and DLA reform and discussed the
impacts of these changes widely in the media. Before joining
Demos in 2008 Claudia was Head of Policy and Research at the
Resolution Foundation, a research organisation focusing on the
welfare and life chances of low-income groups.


Our Chair
Alison Benjamin is a social affairs journalist, award-winning
editor of the Society pages of the Guardian and a commissioning
editor on the Comment section. Throughout her journalistic career
she has given a voice to marginalised people and sought to raise
awareness about unpopular, or hidden, causes. She has worked
at the Guardian since 2000.




LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 9
WHAT ARE THE BARRIERS?
T
he barriers to social and economic inclusion for
disabled people raised during the discussion include
the following:
1. A damaging narrative on disability:
There is a culture and climate of hostility, suspicion
and negativity towards disabled people which
exemplifes itself in many ways from hate crime,
stigmatization and misunderstandings (particularly
with regard to mental health) to discrimination in
the workplace and beyond.
There is a lack of understanding that those who
cannot work still have intrinsic worth and value
as citizens with a basic human right to dignity and
independence.
There is a need for political leadership in order to
change the narrative about disabled people so that
it is positive, empowering, and ambitious as well
as realistic about the work that needs to be done
in government to secure substantive social and
economic reforms.
It is also felt that this barrier is related to a lack
of political representation and empowerment
with the disability rights movement and inclusion
within the mainstream political parties several
years behind inclusion for similar civil rights
movements which have taken place for women,
ethnic minorities and lesbian, gay, bisexual and
transgendered individuals.
2. Lack of access to employment and the workplace,
with particular problems associated with remaining in
1
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 10
the workplace after the development of a disability.
3. Barriers in relation to the breakdown of the social
security system and challenges associated with the
Work Capability Assessment and the Access to Work
scheme. People fnd themselves in a system that drives
them further away from the workplace rather than
assisting them into it. There was a consensus that there
is a pressing need for reform to these systems so that
processes and support are more responsive to the needs
of disabled individuals.
4. The impact of austerity through the top slicing of
individual benefts there will be a cumulative negative
impact on disabled people amounting to reductions in
funding and support of 28bn between 2010-2017. This
is exacerbated by a cost-of-living crisis which is posing
a real challenge to social and economic inclusion.
5. Lack of access resulting from the failure to reduce
physical barriers. Our environment, infrastructure
and society is poorly designed for access and impedes
social inclusion for disabled people.
6. The failure to promote measures to facilitate
independent living and increased visibility, as well as
measures to support carers and their access to fnance,
as well as to tackle fnancial hardship for carers and
those they care for.


LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 11
BARRIER 1 : A DAMAGING NARRATIVE
The Climate of Hostility
Kate Green MP opened the discussion by referring to the
climate of hostility, suspicion and negativity which faces
disabled people today and because of which their rights
and status are being marginalised
One participant spoke of the horrifc bullying which her
son, who is diabetic and has mild autism spectrum issues,
has sufered at school. She pointed out that schools only
have a statutory responsibility to report bullying if it is
racially or sexually motivated.
Emily Holzhausen said that Carers UK saw an increase
in 2010 in reports from the number of families who were
experiencing I suppose what is, to put not too fne a
point on it, hate crime, and atitudes which are totally
unacceptable.
The Damaging Narrative
Claire Nurden (Multiple Sclerosis Society and co-chair
of the Disability Benefts Consortium) spoke out about
how the rhetoric around disability has allowed stringent
changes to benefts to be implemented without sufcient
public scrutiny.
She gave as an example the 20 metre rule for the enhanced
rate mobility component of PIP and asked whether the
whole of society would think it is right for people who can
walk just further than 20 metres not to get the fnancial
support they need any more.
Mary Grifths-Clarke, (Parliamentary Candidate for the
Labour Party and Executive Commitee member, Disability
2
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 12
Labour) said that there needed to be a recognition that
some people arent able to go back to work and they will
never be able to go back to work and that there was a
rhetoric that you are only worthy in society that if you
are somehow aspiring to get back to employment in an
environment where employers just dont want you.
She highlighted the negative impact on disabled peoples
mental health and view of themselves and the need to
promote policies that support a decent standard of living
and the ability to engage with wider society in non-work
environments for disabled people who are not able to
work. Grifths-Clark spoke of the cases of disabled people
feeling suicidal that she has come across: I have had so
many people coming to me in my constituency saying we
just want to go to Switerland. We have to change this, it is
absolutely appalling, and it is heart-breaking.
Tom Pollard spoke about the need to shift the focus away
from assuming that disabled people were responsible for
their own situation towards a focus on tackling the barriers
for disabled people. He said that the assumption is that
problem is motivation and willingness to work rather than
external, for example, inaccessible workplaces. He spoke in
particular of the need to make workplaces more conducive
to beter mental health.
Alongside understanding the need to change the narrative
and to tackle the climate of negativity and climate, Kate
Green MP also noted that it was difcult for legislators
to change peoples mindsets and prejudice without a
collective efort across society but that we can do some
things as politicians, including giving clear leadership.
She said that the present government was really poor at
giving that positive leadership and had failed challenge
the hostile rhetoric about disabled people.
How can this barrier be overcome?
Claudia Wood said that the next Labour government had a
decision on whether it will follow public opinion or lead it.
This government, she said, have been masters in shaping
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 13
public opinion to justify a lot of the reforms that have been
made. As a consequence of this they have been able to do
a lot of things without close scrutiny. She argued that if
you can lead public opinion to go one way, you can shape
it to go the other way. She said that for a new government
the frst year - when they are at their strongest - is the time
to be brave, ambitious and bold. Shifts in perceptions, she
said are not static - things have moved one way and they
can move the other way.
Daniel Elton, (former editor of blog Left Foot Forward) also
spoke more specifcally to the disability rights organisations
in the room of the need for a political plan to build public
opinion and a consensus which would in turn enable
politicians to have the space to implement good policy.
Emily Holzhausen said that it was important for
policymakers to have ambition for the future in the light of
what good public spending looks like for a more inclusive
society. She referred to Scopes 2010 report, entitled Polls
Apart
2
which highlighted real concerns with disabled
peoples access to polling stations and to the exercise of
a secret ballot. The report also reinforced the broader
importance of building a democracy more inclusive for
disabled people so that it could in turn be more responsive to
disabled peoples voices.
Ros Wynne-Jones (columnist, Daily Mirror) added to
this, speaking of the Daily Mirrors constant reporting of
peoples experience at the sharp end of welfare reform.
She identifed a real opportunity here for some kind of
Operation Disabled Vote, where sick and disabled people
make themselves into an electoral college, which cant be
ignored.
Changing the narrative, it was felt, was also tied to
examining disability as an issue beyond welfare and
benefts (and beyond the remit of the Department for Work
and Pensions).
2 Polls Apart 2010 : Opening Elections to Disabled People; Clive Gil-
bert, Cristina Sarb and Marc Bush, Published by Scope, 6 Market
Road, London.
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 14
Sue Marsh suggested that advisers on disability issues
should be present in each central government department
so that they are taken seriously and the suggestions they
make carried forward and considered.
Claudia Wood acknowledged the importance of recognizing
disability as an issue that cuts across a range of portfolios
and also suggested that there should be a commissioner for
disabled peoples rights across the board.
The suggestions here are:
To consider ways of empowering and enabling more
disabled people to vote.
To develop a political strategy in partnership with key
stakeholders and organisations that beter engages
disabled voters in shaping policy.
To develop a strategy that seeks to lead and shape
public opinion and perceptions on disability.
To build on ongoing work by the Labour Party to
ensure disabled peoples voices are heard within the
party. This would model the Operation Black Vote
scheme and as well as mentoring schemes for women
(such as the Fabian Womens Network mentoring
programme) which have had tangible success in
increasing ethnic minority and womens participation
in the Labour Party.
To introduce a commissioner for disabled peoples
rights and for advisers on disability issues in every
central government department so that policy on
disability is more joined up.


LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 15
BARRIER 2: EMPLOYMENT
GETTING INTO WORK AND
STAYING IN WORK
Kate Green MP said that there needed to be a focus,
not just on geting more disabled people who are not
working into employment, but also on keeping people
in employment when they become sick or disabled. 70%
of people who have a disability acquire it in the course
of their working life. The rate of employment is about
30% lower for disabled people than non-disabled people,
with particularly poor employment rates for people with
learning difculties and mental health problems.
She referenced a report by Scope,
3
the national disability
charity, that had carried out research on how halving
the employment gap between disabled and non-disabled
people could make a signifcant contribution to the
economy as well as realising the right of disabled people to
fnd employment if they are able work.
Green also said that the Work Programme had failed
in recent atempts to provide personalised support for
those claimants who need help looking for and staying in
work. She and Stephen Timms MP, Shadow Minister of
State for Employment had a preference for more localised
interventions rather than a centrally-driven top down
national programme, with an opportunity for specialist and
niche providers who understand local needs beter.

A signifcant improvement in engagement with employers
is needed, since most employers are hesitant, often not
3 A Million Futures: Halving the Disability Employment Gap; Rob-
ert Troter, Scope April 2014
3
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 16
knowing what interventions to put in place. Green said
that we need to design the way in which we provide that
support, that coaching, that education of employers.
Participants also spoke about discrimination at recruitment
stages, and how discrimination in the workplace afects
access to work for disabled people.
For example, one participant (a mental health social
worker for a local authority in West Yorkshire) referred to
the stigma around mental health and how employers dont
want to give people with mental health issues a job. I work
with people who may have a fuctuating condition and
such people, he said, are faced with the dilemma whether
to disclose or not. In theory the disability discrimination
act should protect them, but if they say they are bipolar or
sufer from schizophrenia they will not get a second look.
Sue Marsh said that when she became a wheelchair user
she was shocked to discover the barriers: It wasnt that I
couldnt work she said, it was no-one wanted me to work
for them.
Peter Purton (TUC, Disability and LGBT rights)
highlighted the use of sickness absence procedures which
were being enforced by employers in a difcult economic
climate which results in discrimination against disabled
people. He felt that a future government could take steps
to deal with these issues.
Tom Pollard said: we all have good and bad days,
adding: mental health is something that progressive
employers are taking seriously, because creating a
mentally healthy work place is beter for everyone, not
just people with mental health problems.
Kate Green MP spoke about the Access to Work programme,
a central government programme that sits in the Department
for Work and Pensions ofering fnancial assistance to
support disabled people in the workplace. She said that the
scheme is liked and admired but that hardly anybody seems
to know about it and take-up is often quite difcult.
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 17
Tom Pollard highlighted how assumptions about
disabled peoples personal responsibility for being out
of work themselves pose a barrier to supporting those
people into work.
Pollard talked about Minds support for a Work
Programme service user survey of over 500 people who
were claiming ESA and receiving back-to-work support
from the Work Programme or Job Centre Plus. 60% of those
surveyed felt they were further away from work as a result
of the process they were being forced to engage with and
that they were more anxious and less confdent.
Most of those surveyed said that they wanted to work,
they felt they could make a valuable contribution to
employers, and they felt like they understood what the
barriers were stopping geting them into work. But the
support they were receiving didnt refect those barriers.
The support was generic, it was support focused on their
motivation and willingness to work and ability to time-
keep. The way they were treated and the pressure they
were put under was making it more difcult for them to
engage with the process.
4
One participant also placed challenges relating to geting
disabled people back into work within the context of the
wider problem of high unemployment -one key element
in making sure that work places are beter for people with
disabilities or any barriers is full employment. You tighten
up the labour market and employers have to start to adapt.
How Can The Barriers Be Overcome?
Some of the ways in which some of the barriers identifed
could be overcome are through:
Ensuring that the Work Programme provides
sufficiently personalised support that is targeted at
4 Fulflling Potential? ESA and the Fate of the Work Related Activity
Group; Catherine Hale supported by Mind, 2014 (htp://www.mind.
org.uk/media/933438/2014-support-not-sanctions-report.pdf).
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 18
what is needed to get a particular individual back
into work.
Supporting employers to create workplaces that are
accessible to those who are disabled, including those
with mental health conditions
Encouraging and educating employers, including in
relation to the fuctuating nature of some conditions, in
order to retain and recruit disabled and sick employees.
Raising awareness of disability issues amongst
employers and developing efective enforcement
mechanisms for disability legislation so that
discrimination on the grounds of disability in the
workplace and beyond are prevented and tackled.

















LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 19
BARRIER 3: THE SOCIAL SECURITY
SYSTEM AND CHALLENGES,
INCLUDING WORK CAPABILITY
ASSESSMENT
Work Capability Assessment
Kate Green MP set out Labours approach. Under Labours
plans, everybody who goes through the Work Capability
Assessment (WCA) will receive a statement of how their
condition or their impairment would afect their capacity
to work. They would be able to take that statement with
them to discuss with employers and employment training
providers and Work Programme providers to help shape
the individualised support they need to be able to work.
Green said such an approach was important both because
it returned the WCA to its original role as a first step to
enabling those who can work to be in employment. But
it would also put control more directly in the hands of
disabled people themselves to shape the discussion about
the support they needed.
Green also promised Labour would continue the annual
review of the WCA process, and again disabled people
would have a role in that review process. She also
confrmed there would be penalties on assessors for poor
and wrong decisions.
A participant asked if the statement mentioned by Kate
Green on someones skills and abilities would allow
someone to challenge a prospective employer.
Sue Marsh said that the fundamental faw is that the Work
4
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 20
Capability Assessment is at present seen solely as a route
into work, whereas disabled people see it as their livelihood.
Until this is recognized, going through the process will
remain incredibly stressful. First and foremost anyone who
deserves the beneft needs to get it, she said. Work for us
comes after, if were capable of doing that work.
Marsh agreed that the United Kingdom is at present
one of the worst-performing countries at access to work
for disabled people, citing Sweden who, get something
like 40% of people with disabilities of people who claim
benefts into work, compared to the UK statistic of 20%.
Nonetheless, she pointed out that even if the UK were
successful in narrowing this gap, there will always be some
people who cannot work and that there is no policy that
will suddenly fnd 90% of disabled people working.
Claudia Wood suggested that that the WCA should have
two functions: Firstly an assessment to work out roughly
what fnancial support individuals need while out of work,
and secondly a programme of assessments to work out
types of support people might need to get back into work
as a follow on.
The WCA currently is only the former of these, a high
stakes gate keeping function, leading to duplication
with Work Programme providers (or worse, meaning
disabled people have no proper assessment of the support
they need). A complete assessment of an individuals
employability would have to cover amongst many other
things, physical health, mental health, skills, and emotional
resilience.
With regard to the second programme of assessments she
suggested that following an assessment of employability,
a personal budget could be allocated to an individual
according to an employment plan mirroring the process
in social care. Individuals could purchase the range of
services they need. For some people that is going to be
skills training and occupational therapy, and for others it
might be psychological therapies. Each bespoke package
would be developed in an on-going process with a beter
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 21
Work Programme and work choices regime, enabling
people to shop around for exactly what they need rather
than being shoe-horned into an infexible system where
incentives (payment by results) do not encourage specifc
help for harder- to-employ individuals.
Stef Benstead (of the Spartacus Network and co-author
of The Beyond Barriers: ESA, The Work Programme and
Recommendations for a New System of Support report) said
that she felt the entire Work Capability Assessment was
fundamentally fawed, every single part of it. Benstead
raised the following concerns:
the assessors are not qualifed enough or in the right
way, with physiotherapists ofering opinions on mental
health, or with medical judgements made by those not
medically trained
there is litle use of corroborative and supporting
evidence
the points system within the WCA does not work for
many people, particularly those with mental health
issues, learning disabilities and fuctuating conditions.
the WCA often focuses exclusively on medical issues
but the question of whether a person is employable is
much broader than that.
other considerations need to be taken into account
for example, whether a disabled person has caring or
family responsibilities, or whether that person may
have a commute which potentially poses a drain on
their resources.
Stef Benstead stressed that, we need to be saying what
level of support do people need, how much support, or
how long do they need it for if they are going to go into
work and doing that research.
Stef Benstead said that the barriers to work were broader
than the range of tasks defned in the Work Capability
Assessment. It is crucial to look at whether the abilities
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 22
people have got matches the skills and experience they
have got. She gave as an example someone who has been
a manual labourer, and now has a physical condition. They
will struggle, she said, to change career without help. She
said that more research is needed to understand what level
of support and how long it will be needed if people are to
be beter able to access work.
Tom Pollard said that the way in which claimants are
treated results from wrong assumptions being made about
them that being out of work is the result of personal
responsibility and their own fault. Atitudes needed to
change for reform in this area.
He added that processes often assumed that claimants
overplay the impact of their disability whereas many
claimants (especially those with mental health problems)
will underplay their disability for a range of reasons. The
result is that the process ends up actually working counter
to the aims it is supposed to work towards.
Kierra Box (Campaigns Ofcer, Citizens Advice Bureau)
said that there was a need for improved quality of
medical evidence, as well as to consider how to make
it signifcantly easier for GPs and health & social care
professionals to provide the required information.
Box reported that the Citizens Advice Bureau were running
a campaign to ensure that ESA was ft for purpose since
the Equality Act requires all bodies to make reasonable
adjustments as a legal duty for all who have a disability or
a long-term health condition. She said that, the DWP are
in many cases not actually living up to the requirement for
them to anticipate and provide reasonable adjustments for
disabled people who are going through assessments for
disability and ill-health benefts.
5


5 Make ESA ft for work Citizens Advice campaign htp://
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/index/campaigns/current_cam-
paigns/ftforwork.htm
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 23
How Can The Barriers Be Overcome?
The suggestions here are:
To overhaul the assessment processes so that they
are more coherent, listen to disabled people, and
take account of their specifc needs in a holistic way
which is comprehensive. All relevant evidence must
be considered and should not focus exclusively on
medical needs but on employability as a wider concept.
The objective of the process should be to enable all
people involved to assemble the right support to enable
access to work with the constant proviso that it is a
realistic proposition that the individual person can
realistically fnd and stay in work.
To ensure that, alongside funding to secure for people
the income they need to live whilst out of work,
individuals are empowered to access the workplace
through allocated personal budgets.
To ensure that reasonable adjustments are being met
and delivered throughout the assessment and review
processes in light of the fact the ESA assessment
process is itself a public service.
To secure more accurate, high quality medical and
psychological assessments of those who go through
assessment processes and consequently to review and
take steps to address the undersupply of trained and
professional staf who carry out assessments.

LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 24
BARRIER 4: THE IMPACT OF
AUSTERITY AND CUTS TO BENEFITS
Claudia Wood spoke of the need for an ongoing cumulative
impact assessment. It is, she said, the governments
policy to top slice every beneft, making individual impact
assessments (the current approach) unft for purpose.
Top slicing has resulted in some families losing three, four,
fve or six individual benefts. Demos looked at 15 of the
main benefts people claim and worked out how many
of these overlapped. We found that it was common for
disabled people to be claiming three benefts simultaneously
such as ESA, DLA (PIP) and housing beneft, but many
claimed several more. Demos saw that 100,000 people were
losing three benefts at a time. 3,000 in one hard-hit group
experienced six separate cuts to their benefts.

These people are being hit multiple times by the same
reforms but this impact is not currently accounted for in the
individual cumulative assessment process. Overall, Demos
found that 3.7 million disabled people are afected by at least
one beneft cut. By 2017, the point at which the Government
say there will be a new round of welfare cuts, this group will
lose 28 billion in benefts income.
6
Until a comprehensive
CIA is carried out it is impossible to claim that welfare
reform is fair or that the burden is evenly spread.
How can these barriers be overcome?
Claudia Wood spoke of the importance of ensuring that
a cumulative impact assessment of the cuts takes place.
She said: the Government is in denial that cumulative
assessment can be done, that it is too hard in some
6 Destination Unknown April 2013 update - the full tables are htp://
www.demos.co.uk/blog/destinationunknownapril2013
5
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 25
way. Wood believes that this is not the case: various
organisations (including Demos) have made credible
atempts she said. The fact that a government actuary
would probably do a beter job is a given. And it is not
being done. She thinks that the fact that it is not being
done is quite shameful, because the whole agenda is based
on the presumption that beneft cuts are fair and evenly
spread. In order to form an opinion about what policies
are needed to address disability inequality, unemployment,
health outcomes, isolation, stress, and lack of community
engagement amongst disabled households, you have to
think about how much of these issues are exacerbated by
the money being taken out of the pocket.
Kierra Box agreed that we really need a bit of help in
actually geting the Government to provide the statistics
and the information that we need to provide constructive
suggestions here.
Box said that the process is in itself costing money in
increased bureaucracy. She gave as an example that the
government had not yet provided statistics on mandatory
reconsideration and the impact that is having on people in
fnancial difculties as they await a decision on whether they
are eligible for Employment Support Allowance (ESA), as well
as the impact that this may have on the size of the benefts bill.
She said, we have worked out if you are on ESA and you
go for mandatory consideration on to JSA and back on to
ESA, the very least it will cost in admin is 162. Many of
the statistics yet to be disclosed by the government would
prove the counter-productive nature of the decision.
Both Emily Holzhausen and Kierra Box stressed the
importance of measuring and addressing fnancial
hardship itself. Holzhausen spoke of the vital importance
of the Carers Allowance, which Carers UK campaigned to
protect as a vital income for families who cared for their
disabled relatives.
Claudia Wood connected austerity and the barriers it
created with the lack of employment opportunities for
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 26
disabled people. We are spending too much on ESA, she
said because we havent got enough people in work. There
are huge productivity gains and GDP generated by geting
disabled people who can and want to work into work.
Wood pointed out that if barriers such as inaccessible
transport and workplaces and employer prejudice were
addressed, a signifcantly higher proportion of people
would get into work. This would create signifcant savings,
which would, in turn release additional funds for those who
were unable to work but are able to be active volunteers,
community workers, voters, citizens, parents and carers.
She said that as a society, we were spending too much on
ESA, but not spending enough on the Disability Living
Allowance (Personal Independence Payments) [DLA][PIP]).
It was important that we spend much more on geting
people back into work, as that would never be equal to the
amount we lose by locking people out of the labour market
for their entire lives.
The suggestions here are:
For the government to undertake a cumulative impact
assessment on the range of austerity measures that
have afected disabled people and their carers in order
to beter understand how to support disabled claimants
into work, as well as those disabled claimants who
cannot work.
To quantify and measure the fnancial hardship that
has arisen as a result of the cumulative impact of the
cuts to disabled families and disabled individuals.
To provide statistics on the cost of increasingly complex
procedures, such as mandatory reconsideration, in order
to reduce administrative costs that could be beter used.
To quantify the impact that the upfront investment in
the removal of barriers would have on the proportion
of disabled people able to access work, and in turn, to
quantify the impact that this investment would have in
reducing the bill to the government of out-of-work benefts.
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 27
BARRIER 5: DESIGN, PLANNING
AND PHYSICAL ACCESS
Buildings
Sue Marsh set the scene for the discussion: she said that
she had only started using a wheelchair about 18 months
ago, and that it had been an eye opener.
She also spoke about the continued inadequate design of
buildings, planning and infrastructure. She had visited a
hotel that had recently spent 11 million on a renovation
but the only way to get the wheelchair into the hotel was
on the laundry pallet lift with nothing to keep her safe.
We couldnt go and see the lovely chandeliers because we
couldnt get up the four stairs to the lobby - we had to use
the goods lift, not the hotel lift.
Public transport
A participant from the foor gave voice to the frustrations
felt by those trying to commute to work on public
transport, highlighting the barriers faced simply in going to
work every single day. Amongst the many problems is the
lack of sufciently accessible public transport, including the
difculties of geting more than two wheelchairs on the same
train. She also referred to the batle with the buggy space
on buses, and said that she is told on the bus in the morning
that she is taking up valuable commuter space without
recognition of the fact that she is commuting herself.
She mentioned the need to book in advance on trains
something that is not possible for people who work and
cannot guarantee what train they are going to get on.
The batle we are having to get train companies to even
acknowledge that people may want to turn up and go is
phenomenal. It just doesnt make sense, she said.
6
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 28
How Can These Barriers Be Overcome?
The barriers mentioned above in themselves suggest
possible solutions:
Undertaking a consultation with disabled stakeholders
on what specifc barriers are and undertaking a review
into how a future Labour government could best
address those barriers. These might include but are not
limited to measures such as:
Requiring planning applications to consider and
show they have met access requirements raised by
equality impact assessments at the earliest possible
stage.
Requiring providers of public transport to meet
reasonable adjustments for disabled travellers and
ensuring that large-scale contracts have incentives
to ensure that they deliver on these issues.
Engaging with government at a local and regional level
to create strategies for infuencing key external bodies
on disability issues (e.g rail companies, construction
companies and design organisations).

LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 29
BARRIER 6: SOCIAL BARRIERS THE
AMBITION FOR INDEPENDENT LIVING
The loss of Independent Living as an achievable objective
Disabled peoples right to live independently is set out
in the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with
Disabilities to which the UK is a signatory. It was agreed
that is something we should acknowledge and talk about.
Kate Green MP said independent living represents a broad
concept, and is about more than the independent living
fund, though that is not to underestimate the importance
of the fund for those people who receive it. She added that
our public policy needs to be about the whole ambition for
independent living.
She thinks that the last Labour Government got that when
they published Improving the Life Chances of Disabled
People.
7
A good place to start in taking forward the
ambition to secure the ability to live independently would
be to return to that document. Of course, progress will
need to be incremental, she said, but the direction of travel
is important.
The Loss of Community & Family Resilience
Emily Holzhausen highlighted the need to focus on the
cumulative impact of cuts and the barriers created for
those supporting and caring for disabled people as well
as for those people needing care. She spoke of the ripple-
7 Improving the Life Chances of Disabled People January 2005 A Joint
Report with Department of Work and Pensions, Department of
Health, Department of Education and Skills and the Ofce of the
Deputy Prime Minister
7
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 30
through to family and close friends and of the impact that
austerity has had, not just on disabled people, but also on
their carers.
She highlighted how the lack of investment in care has
had the efect of puting up more barriers to choice and
control for both disabled people and their families. 3.5
billion had been taken out of social care as a result of
which, she said, were starting to see a rise in the number
of people who are having to take up caring, and having to
give up work to care for relatives.
Many carers are being forced out of work and onto benefts
as a result of the 3.5bn taken out of social care and the
drop in care funding we are starting to see a rise in
the number of people who are having to frstly take up
caringand also the number of people who are very hard-
pressed in the work-place and having to give up work even
to care for relatives.
She said that this is a key economic issue, particularly for
women in the age group of 45-54 up to pension age. If we
continue to undermine social care in this way, she said,
not only do we not give disabled people the opportunity
to live full lives, to work and have a legitimate place in
society, but we also place additional pressure on families
and particularly women.
Holzhausen said that a number of European governments
understood that investing in care means that they
are investing in the work force Also it is important to
pay them well. She spoke of the importance of giving
workplace rights to those who need to juggle work and
caring for family members, and of seeing care as a model
for economic growth.
She concluded that we should focus on back to work
support for everybody, including family members who
have given up work to care. This is our time, she said to
seize the moment to invest in care in order to create a more
inclusive society.

LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 31
How Can These Barriers Be Overcome?
A cumulative impact assessment of cuts and the way in
which they have afected families and carers.
Measures and a strategy for independent living for
disabled people as well as carers of disabled people.
Building the economic case for investing in care
including access to work for carers, drawing upon
successful international models.


















LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 32
SUMMARY OF IDEAS




Changing the Narrative
Empowering and enabling more disabled people to vote.
Engaging disabled voters, possibly as an electoral
college, in shaping policy, and developing a political
strategy in partnership with key stakeholders.
To develop a communications strategy that seeks to
lead and shape public opinion and perceptions on
disability in partnership with key stakeholders.
To build on ongoing work by the Labour Party to
ensure disabled peoples voices are heard within
the party. This would model the already successful
Operation Black Vote scheme and the Fabian
Womens Network mentoring programme.
To introduce a commissioner for disabled peoples rights
and for advisers on disability issues to be placed in every
central government department.
Access to work
Ensuring that the Work Programme provides
personalised support that is targeted at what is needed
to get a particular individual back into work.
Supporting employers to create workplaces that are
accessible to those who are disabled, including those
with mental health conditions.
Encouraging and educating employers on what they can
do to improve the recruitment and retention of disabled
employees. This includes promoting greater understanding
of the fuctuating nature of some conditions.
8
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 33
Developing efective enforcement mechanisms for
disability legislation so that discrimination on the
grounds of disability in the workplace and beyond are
prevented and tackled.
Fixing the Social Security System
To overhaul assessment processes so that they are more
coherent, listen to disabled people, and take account
of their specifc needs in a holistic and comprehensive
way. It is essential that all relevant evidence is
considered and focuses on employability as a wider
concept beyond specifc medical conditions.
To ensure that the WCA has two functions: frstly to
secure for people the income they need to live on,
and secondly that they are empowered to access the
workplace through allocated personal budgets and
individualised support (if they can work).
To ensure that reasonable adjustments are being met and
delivered throughout the assessment and review processes
in light of the fact that ESA is itself a public service.
To secure more accurate, high quality medical and
psychological assessments of those who go through
assessment processes and consequently to review and
take steps to address the undersupply of trained and
professional staf who carry out assessments.
The Impact of Austerity
The government needs to undertake a cumulative
impact assessment on the range of austerity measures
and top slicing of benefts that have afected disabled
people and their carers in order to beter understand
how to develop a system that works.
To quantify and measure the fnancial hardship that
has arisen as a result of the cumulative impact of the
cuts to disabled families and disabled individuals.
To provide statistics on the cost of increasingly complex
procedures, such as mandatory reconsideration, in order
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 34
to reduce administrative costs that could be beter used.
To quantify the impact that the upfront investment in
the removal of barriers would have on the proportion
of disabled people able to access work, and the
impact that this would have in reducing the bill to the
government of out-of-work benefts.
The Physical Barriers
Undertaking a consultation with disabled stakeholders
on what specifc barriers are and undertaking a review
into how a future Labour government could best
address those barriers. These might include but are not
limited to measures such as:
Requiring planning applications to consider and show
they have met access requirements raised by equality
impact assessments at the earliest possible stage.
Requiring providers of public transport to meet
reasonable adjustments for disabled travellers and
ensuring that large scale contracts have incentives
to ensure that they deliver on these issues.
Engaging with government at a local and regional level
to create strategies for infuencing key external bodies
on disability issues (e.g rail companies, construction
companies and design organisations).
Social Barriers and Building Community & Family Resilience
a cumulative impact assessment of cuts and the way in
which they have afected families and carers.
measures and a strategy for independent living for
disabled people, as well as measures and a strategy to
support their carers.
building the economic case for investing in care
including access to work for carers, drawing upon
successful international models.
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS | 35
CONCLUSION
W
e have outlined some of the barriers and some
of the possible solutions, drawing upon the
contributions of atendees of the event on 16
th

July 2014, and we would like to conclude by quoting Sue
Marsh, who called for a civil rights movement and a
radical shake-up.
She said, we all say it is not working and it has to be done
diferently, fundamentally diferently. This is a consensus...
we need fundamental change of everything. From inclusive
living, independent living, access, barriers, education,
transport and the welfare system. I would like to see a lot
more movement on that and to be honest if you are outside
the consensus you need to come into it.
This pamphlet is intended, not just to invite people into the
consensus, but also to invite stakeholders to take an active
part in shaping that consensus.
9
FABIAN WOMENS NETWORK PAMPHLET
LETS TALK ABOUT THE BARRIERS

BECAUSE DISABILITY RIGHTS ARE HUMAN RIGHTS

By Susie Gilbert and Reema Patel
This pamphlet has been drawn out from the discussion at the event
held by the Fabian Womens Network on the 16
th
July 2014 at which
we raised the questions: What are the barriers for disabled people to
social and economic inclusion and how can they be overcome?
The event provided an accessible environment in which disabled
people, their carers, advisers, politicians, advocates and a number
of disability rights organisations and campaigners could debate the
urgent questions being posed by the political, social and economic
climate of the day.